Justice League International vs West Coast Avengers

This is a DynaMic Network Podcast. 

Hi, welcome to the Dynamic Duel Podcast, a weekly show where we review superhero films and debate the superiority between Marvel and DC by comparing their characters and stat-based battle simulations. I'm Johnny DC. 

And I'm his twin brother, Marvelous Joe. 

And in this episode, we are taking a break from the reviews to do a team duel, this time a rematch between the Justice League and Avengers, but more specifically, the Justice League International against the West Coast Avengers. 

Yeah, there are different spin-off branches of the traditional Justice League and Avengers teams. I got to say, Jonathan, this is my chance for sweet ass revenge against the Justice League for what happened in our first initial team duel all those years ago. 

Yeah, that was episode 100. That seems like forever ago. 

It was back in 2018, back when we were just kids. 

Oh, what I wouldn't give to be seven years younger. Well, it's gonna be a fun match this episode. Look forward to that later on. Before that, we're not going to break down the comic book movie news because as per the norm for the past several weeks, there really isn't any like James Gunn has been talking a lot about various DC projects, but nothing really concrete. Penguin did get nominated for 24 Emmys, but that's not really news until I actually win something. We're all just kind of waiting for Fantastic Four to come out and just lose horribly box office wise and critically to Superman. 

Yeah, when Fantastic Four beats Superman's opening weekend, we could definitely talk about that in the new section. That'll be fun. 

Yeah, or vice versa. Superman beats Fantastic Four. It's not going to happen. You sack of shit. Roll up. Roll up, bro. I guess we'll find out later on this week what happens. 

But as always, we list our segment times in our episode description, so feel free to check out the show notes if you want to skip ahead to a particular topic. 

Guys are artificially intelligent. Dual simulator, AJ9K has a quick message for our listeners. So listen up. 

Why hello there. Do you want even more from this podcast? Then become a part of the dynamic dual community on Patreon, where you can choose from three tiers. The dynamic to a tier gives you access to our discord chat server. The Fantastic Four tier gives you two bonus episodes each month. 

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Thanks AJ9K and thanks to everyone who supports the podcast. 

Be sure to tune into the other shows and the Diner Mike podcast network this week, including the console combat podcast where hosts John and Dean simulate battles between popular video game characters. In yesterday's episode, they determined who would win between Rayman and Jake the dog from Adventure Time. 

Over on the Max Destruction podcast hosts Scotty and Gilly, Pay Your Favor Action Heroes from film and television against each other. This week, they'll be finding out who would win between Aaron Cross from The Born Legacy and Jack Reacher. 

And on the San Joe World podcast hosts Zachary Hepburn speculates on fights between fan favorite anime and manga characters. In his next episode, Zach's going to reveal who would win between Injun from Gaichi Akura and Naito Mudano from Togon Anki. There's no way I'm pronouncing any of that right. 

Visit dynamicpodcasts.com or click the link in our show notes to listen to all of the shows in the Diner Mike podcast network. But with that out of the way, quick to the no prize. 

A no prize is an award that Marvel used to give out to fans. Our version, the Dynamic Dual No Prize, is a digital award we post on Instagram for the person that we feel gave the best answer to our question of the week. Last week, we asked you guys, what do you want the sequel to the Superman movie to be about? And this is coming off of the phenomenal box office opening weekend for the Superman movie, which will more than likely warrant a sequel for the character. 

We got quite a few answers. We're going to break down this week's honorable mentions before revealing the no prize winner. Our first honorable mention goes to Travis Herndon, who said, What's up, dead, I'm a dude. 

Travis here. Shout out to my evil twin. So my answer would be, be like, what if Superman is for the sequel actually meets Mongol? I think Mongol would be a pretty cool villain to introduce in the sequel. He's a tank. This dude is powerful. And this guy also be a nice little wedding of the appetite for DC fans for like whenever dark side shows up, like, hey, this guy with rock and swoop man, shit, magic dark side rocking them. 

Yeah, I love the idea of Superman going up against a formidable physical threat like Mongol, who literally owns an entire planet that's essentially like a Death Star, but way cooler. Yeah, war world. Yeah, we haven't seen Mongol on the silver screen yet. I'd love to see someone new for Superman to fight. And Mongol is a great choice. 

And we know that he exists within this DC universe because we saw his sister Mongal in the Suicide Squad movie that James Gunn also directed. That is correct. 

But hopefully Mongol wouldn't go out like a punk ass like she did with the helicopter. Right, right, right, right. Great answer. Travis, our next honorable mention goes to Alex 

Albro, who said, Hey guys, given the message from Superman's parents, I think there's still a lot left on the table for the media to begin Superman, especially if the antagonist of the second movie is some sort of Kryptonian invader. I think you can get Kara involved there, depending on how they handle it. You could even cause a rift between Superman and Lois based on his actions. 

I think the second movie should end darker just since this first one was pretty upbeat and positive. And I think we still benefit from seeing Superman in a vulnerable position. I think Lex should stay in jail till the third movie or till maybe a Justice League team up where he comes back with an injustice gang. 

Now, of course, we've seen Kryptonian threats go up against Superman in films like Superman to Antiban of Steel, specifically with Zod and his crew. I think if you weren't going to go that direction just to do something new, though, other Kryptonian threats could include like Doomsday or maybe like an evil version of the eradicator. 

We've seen Doomsday as well, but I think this would be an opportunity to do him even better than BVS did. 

That's right. Yeah, we haven't seen him done right, at least. You know, you could do actually, there is a recent villain called Rogel Zarr that was created by Jim Lee, who I think was a creation of Jor-El, and he was revealed to actually be the one responsible for Krypton's destruction. That might be interesting. That would be interesting. Great answer, Alex. Our final honorable mention goes to Brayden Schaffer, who said. 

Brayden here, I think the perfect equal would have Zod being the villain. We could see Superman fight an actual Kryptonian and not a clone. We could see Zod not get killed on screen this time. And we could see how the public thinks of the rest of Krypton after, you know, the whole news article. And I think it'd be great at the end of that to have a post-credits scene teasing Doomsday for that final kind of tease of Superman's big fight. 

I mean, it is really hard to do better than Zod. He's one of Superman's ultimate foes. I wouldn't hate a reimagining of him. And like Brayden and Alex said, it would be a nice continuation of the story established in the first Superman movie. 

Right. Continuing the whole Kryptonian angle where they're more conquerors, almost like Viltramites or something like that. 

Great answer, Brayden. We want to give a quick shout out to Lorenzo Valdez for taking the time to visit our website and record an answer. But the winner of this week's No Price is Cornelius Robinson. Who said? 

Hey, guys, it's Cornelius Robinson. And my idea for the next Superman sequel, we introduced the villain, Brainiac, you know, it would be too soon, but who knows, it is new DC universe. A new character that can also introduce as John Henry Irons, aka Steel, and a possible return for Supergirl to help combat this unknown thread and expanding Superman's responsibility to Earth as well. 

I've been waiting to see Brainiac on the silver screen for so long. He is sort of the ultimate Superman villain. And I don't understand why we haven't seen him on screen yet. I think with Supergirl being introduced in this universe, it also makes perfect sense that Brainiac would come, considering he's the one who shrunk the city of Kandor, where Supergirl's parents lived. Yeah. 

And since he's kind of a tech based villain, it'd be cool for Superman to team up with another tech based hero in Steel and introduce him in that movie and actually get the whole Superman family going up against Brainiac. I think that'd be cool. 

I don't know if I'm quite ready for Steel. I do like the idea of him coming around with the other reign of the Superman Superman characters like Superboy and the eradicator. 

But I could be wrong. Steel is a really cool character. So great answer, Cornelius. You win this week's No Prize. If you're the listener want to shot at winning your own No Prize. Stay tuned to later on in this episode, when we'll be asking another question of the week, which is right now. 

So onto the question of the week. For those who have seen the Fantastic Four first steps in its opening weekend, what did you think? 

And why was it inferior to Superman? If you want to include that in your answer, you mean superior. 

Record your answer at dynamicduel.com by clicking on the red microphone button in the bottom right hand corner of the screen, which will prompt you to leave us a voicemail. Your message could be up to 30 seconds long. And don't forget to leave your name in case we include you on the podcast. We'll pick our favorite answer and award that person a Dynamic Duel No Prize that we'll post to Instagram. Be sure to answer before July 27th. 

But now let's go ahead and move on to the main events of this episode, where we pits against each other, the teams of the Justice League International and the West Coast Avengers. OK, Justice League International versus the West Coast Avengers. As we mentioned earlier, this is something of a rematch for these two teams. Since the very first team duel that we did in episode 100 of this podcast was the Justice League versus the Avengers. But those two teams have such broad rosters. We knew eventually we would be able to get the best of the best and we'd have to circle back with some of these extra characters in the aftershoots that these teams have had in the comics. 

Yeah, plus I just really want to rematch. Yeah, I bet you do. And the West Coast Avengers are just the perfect team to do it. I don't know much about Justice League International, but I know that they're not as good as the West Coast Avengers, which is primarily composed of your standard Avengers. They just moved over to the West Coast for a while, operating out of LA. 

Oh, they operate out of LA. Oh, yeah, the Justice League International operates out of the world, the whole world. It's international, not regulated to a single coast. Where is their headquarters? Actually, they have headquarters all around the world as well. Oh, really? OK. Yeah. 

Why be based around the world when you could be based in LA? Right? Right. No. No. Well, since these teams don't need too much setting up, let's go ahead and get right into it. 

To explain the methodology behind our duels, let's go to our sentient dual simulator, Alfred Jarvis 9000. AJ9K, tell our listeners how you go about determining a winner in our team dual matchups. 

Yes, of course, sir. The way I determine a winner between the two teams is by running 1000 Monte Carlo simulations between every character on each team using their statistics. A Monte Carlo simulation is a probabilistic model used to determine outcomes through random sampling. In this case, I randomize the statistics along a normal distribution as a way to simulate the many variables that can occur during battle. The stat parameters are based on the official Marvel power grid from which the DC characters' statistics are extrapolated. 

Additional stat categories are included such as range, damage potential, versatility and perception in order to create a more detailed and accurate simulation. The results of the 49000 simulations provide a percentage of wins for each character on both teams. The team with the higher average win rate is declared the victor as they have a higher probability to win any given battle. In an equitable pairing, neither team should win 100% of the matches. The comic book stories have shown that there's even a way for Batman to defeat Superman, so the confidence rate of my method falls in line with the precedents that have been established in the source material. My mathematical simulations are without subjectivity or bias. Feats are not the sole consideration, nor are fan votes tabulated for determination of the winner. 

Thanks, AJ9K. Before we run the simulations, though, we'd like to break down each team's histories and rosters before improvising a scenario on how we imagine one of the thousands of simulations would play out beat for beat. 

And I believe it's my turn to go first. So let me break down the West Coast Avengers history. Most of the New York City based Avengers vanished when a cosmic being called the beyonder whisked heroes and villains to a distant world to watch them fight in a secret war. In their absence, acting Avengers Chairman Vision, fearing Earth was underprotected, convinced the US National Security Council to approve a second Avengers team roster on the Pacific Coast and chose Clint Barton, Hawkeye, to command it. You can learn more about the primary Avengers team in the episode where we put them against the Justice League. Hawkeye and his new wife, former shield agent Bobby Mockingbird Morris, bought a neglected seaside estate near Los Angeles and recruited to the initial team the super strong Simon Williams, AKA Wonder Man and Iron Man, who was actually Jim Rhodes wearing Tony Stark's armor at the time, while Stark worked on recovering from his alcoholism. The giant sized scientist Bill Foster, AKA Goliath, oversaw renovations that turned the coastal property into a new base called the Avengers compound. Rounding out the debut roster was the feline heroine Greer Nelson, AKA Tigra, a Chicago native who worked in a lab undergoing secret conditioning experiments that boosted her strength, speed and senses. 

She was later transformed by a member of the Mystic Cat people into the half human, half feline Tigra. After establishing a career as a vigilante, she auditioned for the Avengers, accepting Hawkeye's call to help found the Pacific Division. The West Coast Avengers first crime fighting mission came when the thief called the blank, fled a robbery with tech that accidentally recalled the villain Graviton from exile. Graviton tried to rip Los Angeles off its foundations until the team brought him down. 

The West Coasters then flew east in a Quinn jet to help the original team stop the cosmic schemer Maelstrom, proving the two branches could operate side by side. Hank Pym, the original Ant-Man, moved into the Avengers compound as its resident scientist, while Wonder Man's brother, the Grim Reaper, formed a new lethal legion with Ultron and other villains. The legion ambushed the compound and took the hero's captive, but Mockingbird's surprise ambush distracted the villains long enough for her teammates to break free. The Reaper seemingly died in the fight and Ultron retreated. 

James Rhodes soon revealed his true identity in the Iron Man suit, after which the recovered Tony Stark reclaimed to the armor and roadie became War Machine. Tigra's increasingly feral behavior attracted Craven the Hunter, who stalked her across Hollywood backlots until the Avengers drove him off. Soon afterward, the team's newest member, a devout New Mexican hero, Firebird, was hunted by the demon called Master Pandemonium, intent on reclaiming shards of his broken soul hidden within her. The Avengers tracked the villain to the hidden realm of the cat people, where Tigra bargained to merge her split human and feline selves in return for Pandemonium's death, a deal she later regretted. The villain Dominus next lured the team to New Mexico and used Dr. Doom's time platform to hurl them backward through history. 

Mockingbird was stranded in the 1800s, drugged by Phantom Rider, into believing she loved him. The rest of the team landed in ancient Egypt and clashed with Pharaoh Rama Tut. The moon god Kahnchoo guided his modern champion Moon Knight, Hank Pym and Firebird to mount a rescue. After months of jumping through time, the Avengers reunited, and Mockingbird let her abuser fall to his death. 

Upon returning to the present, the heroes defeated Dominus. A period of governmental tension followed. The mystique's federal squad, the Freedom Force, arrested both Avengers branches on false trees and charges devised by the Zodiac cartel. 

You can learn more about mystique in her duel against Madame Rouge. Soon after, Washington forced the unstable super soldier, John Walker, aka US agent, onto the West Coast roster as Field Leader. Hawkeye resigned in protests, Mockingbird followed, and the pair mentored the quirky Great Lakes Avengers. 

Meanwhile, in the International Coalition dismantled Vision for his past attempt to seize global computer networks. Hank Pym rebuilt him, now chalk white and emotionless, because Wonder Man refused to lend his brain patterns a second time. You can learn more about Vision in his duel against Marsha Manhunter. Vision's blank slate worsened Scarlet Witch's grief after her twin sons, created by her magic, were reabsorbed into the demon Mephisto. Manipulated by Magneto and Time Master Amortus, she attacked her teammates until Agatha Harkness restored her mind. Roster Turnover continued as Spider Woman and the electricity-powered Living Lightning joined the team. 

Stark, battling health issues, faked his death and ceded the team lead to War Machine. Interstellar Conflict soon pulled the West Coast roster back into space. When Kree soldiers used a Stargate near Earth to attack the rival Shiar Empire, both Avengers teams split into three squads to keep the fight away from the sun. The West Coast unit failed to stop Shiar Commandos from stealing the Kree Negabands and a bomb made from that energy killed billions in Kree's space. 

Some members, led by Iron Man, executed the Kree Supreme Intelligence for that genocide, a choice that offended others and left deep scars between teammates. Back on Earth, the Avengers roster shifted again. Tigra, Hank Pym and the Wasp moved to reserve status, letting US agent Spider Woman and Living Lightning step into full membership. Hawkeye and War Machine rejoined and the teenager Darkhawk joined as a part-time player. Ultron returned in adamantium form, infected Hawkeye, Tigra and Quicksilver with techno-organic implants and unveiled Alkama, a murderous bride cloned from Mockingbird's mind. The Avengers purged the implants and turned Ultron's own missile against him and Alkama, apparently destroying them both. Hank Mann, backed by demons Satanish and Mephisto, formed another lethal legion and struck the depleted West Coast Avengers. 

In the Infernal fight, Mockingbird sacrificed herself to save Scarlet Witch and she died in Clint's arms. The Avengers compound lay in ruins, membership had fallen and disputes were constant. Captain America convened an all-hands vote and led by Stark, the majority closed the West Coast branch. Stark then formed a new team called Forceworks with several West Coast alumni, but that group collapsed within a year and most members drifted back to the main Avengers. 

The deserted Avengers compound later reopened as the training campus for teenage heroes of Avengers Academy. California still lacked frontline defenders, however, so Kate Bishop, the second Hawkeye, started a detective agency in Santa Monica. When giant Landsharks rampaged along the pier, she called Clint for backup and assembled a fresh West Coast Avengers lineup, including the dimension-hopping Miss America, the energy-absorbing Fuse, the sarcastic telepath Kid Omega, and the reality-warping Gwen Pool, who adopted a baby Landshark named Jeff. Mademask soon captured the rookies with her West Coast Masters of Evil, but Kate's ex-boyfriend, Novar, aka Marvel Boy, helped them escape. 

The team then received new headquarters in Venice Beach. During the dark Elf Lord Malekith's invasion of Earth, Kate joined a babysitting squad guarding Thor's infant sister, Lhasa, while her teammates fought Frost Giants in San Francisco. Afterward, Tony Stark and Rody organized a rehabilitation-focused West Coast roster that included longtime ally Spider Woman and veteran hero Firestar. Their opening mission dismantled a machine-based religious cult called the Gospel of Ultrons, which was formed from the fragments of Ultron. And that's the West Coast Avengers history. For the seven-person roster going into the team duel, I'll admit I was a little loose with the official members. For starters, I did include several of the founding West Coast Avengers members, including War Machine, Wonder Man, and Tigra. The Wasp was an early recruit to the team, so I'm including her. 

Quicksilver was a later recruit, but I've been dying to squeeze him in a team duel and passed over our last X-Factor duel just to have him here. For the final two spots, I'll admit I'm going a little rogue and blurring the lines between what constitutes a West Coast Avenger and a regular Avenger. Black Panther has never officially been part of the West Coast roster, but he has fought alongside them. And given that he's been a major player for the Avengers over the years, I thought it best that I include him in one of these team duels. The same goes for Hercules, who again has never been an official West Coast member, but is an Avenger nevertheless, through and through. And frankly, a lot of the other prominent West Coast Avengers members have already been in team duels like Hawkeye, Ant-Man, Scarlet Witch, and Vision were with the main Avengers in their duel. Mockingbird was with the A-Force, Moon Knight was with the Defenders, US Agent was just with the Thunderbolts. I could have gotten some reserve members in here like Darkhawk or Firebird or Living Lightning, but I thought it was better to go with Black Panther and Hercules. Because now I think you can say that most of the classic comic Avengers have been in a team duel. So to reiterate, my West Coast Avengers team is War Machine, Wonder Man, TIGRA, The Wasp, Quicksilver, Black Panther and Hercules. 

That may be most bored I've ever been listening to one of your backstories. 

They don't have a great backstory. It's not very thematic and it's burdened by a lot of roster changes, enclosures and things like that. 

At least the roster is cool. I actually really like this roster, even though it's not entirely faithful. It is a good cast of Avengers characters, I would say. 

Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, largely you went with these characters also because of the pairings with the JLI roster that you have in that we like to keep things even between the teams by pairing each individual character with a counterpart from the other side, but I'll let you get into the Justice League International roster as you get into their history, which I'll do now. 

Now, after the disbanding of the original Justice League of America, a new United Nations backed initiative formed a global peacekeeping superhero team under the banner of the Justice League. The league was reorganized with the intention of operating internationally with multiple embassies and government oversight. Spearheaded by UN liaison Maxwell Lord, the new team operated out of the embassies in New York City, Moscow, Paris, London and Tokyo with their primary headquarters in the secret sanctuary, a former hidden headquarters of the Justice League of America just outside of Happy Harbor, Rhode Island. The initial roster consisted of a mix of veteran heroes and newer recruits. Blue Beetle, Booster Gold, Guy Gardner, the Green Lantern, Martian Manhunter, Black Canary, Shazam, Dr. Fate and Mr. 

Miracle, with Batman serving as a guiding presence. Over time, the team added more international members, such as Fire from Brazil, Ice from Norway, Rocket Red from the Soviet Union and the Crimson Fox from France. The group developed a reputation for balancing world threatening commissions with interpersonal dysfunction and comedic tension, particularly between characters like Guy Gardner and Booster Gold. The team battled numerous global threats, including a new royal flush gang and the time-manipulating overmaster. They also defended Earth from alien invasions and collaborated with other superhero groups around the world. As the organization grew, it fractured into multiple branches. The main team continued as Justice League International, while a European branch was founded later under the name Justice League Europe, operating out of a Chateau in the Loré Valley of France. 

Justice League Europe's roster eventually included elongated men, metamorpho, power girl and Captain Adam. Though the league enjoyed official recognition, tensions arose with traditional US authorities and internal conflicts began to weaken its unity. Maxwell Lord increasingly manipulated the team's direction behind the scenes, using his influence and technology to control outcomes. The team's operations took them across the globe, from Japan to Bialia, a fictional Middle Eastern country where they were often entangled in political intrigue. In one mission, they stopped the Queen Bee's attempt to create a mid-human army. 

Another one took them to Apocalypse, where Mr. Despite their successes, the team was often mocked by the media as being more of a circus than a serious force, a reputation not helped by the personalities of its more flamboyant members. Booster Gold and Blue Beetle, in particular, developed a close friendship that became central to the team's dynamic, often spearheading care-brained business ventures and stunts that caused both trouble and amusement for the group. Over time, leadership changed hands. Batman eventually left due to ideological differences with Maxwell Lord. 

Captain Adam took a leadership role for a time, while Martian Manhunter served as a stabilizing presence. The league continued operating internationally, but fractures deepened when internal corruption was revealed. Maxwell Lord was exposed for secretly manipulating events using a computer system called Kilgore. 

After being shot, Lord was temporarily replaced by Oberon and later by other UN appointees. The Justice League International eventually disbanded. Some of its members continued on with a newly reformed Justice League of America, while others retired or pursued solo missions. Years later, Maxwell Lord attempted to rebrand his public image and reassemble a smaller, more relatable superhero team. He contacted several former members of the Justice League International and convinced them to join a new low-profile operation known as the Super Buddies. Operating out of a strip mall office in Queens, New York, the team included Blue Beetle, Booster Gold, Fire, Elongated Man, his wife Sue Dibney, and Captain Adam, along with Maxwell Lord and Oberon as support staff. 

Later additions included Mary Marvel and the magical chimpanzee Detective Chimp. The Super Buddies focused on local threats and public engagement. Their operations were less about world saving and more about improving their public image and self-esteem. They tackled issues like hostage situations and metahuman disputes, but often found themselves overwhelmed or outmatched. Despite the comedy and dysfunction that surrounded the group, they genuinely tried to help their community. At one point, the team was kidnapped to hell by demons posing as superheroes, forcing them to work together to escape. 

In another incident, they were trapped inside of a magical sitcom reality. The Super Buddies eventually disbanded after realizing they were not suited for full-time heroics. The experience, however, deepened the bonds between many of the original Justice League International members and offered closure to long-standing tensions within the group. 

After the Super Buddies disbanded, several of its members returned to mainstream superhero activity. Maxwell Lord, who had remained publicly dormant for years, resurfaced with telepathic powers and a hidden agenda. Secretly working to eliminate superhumans, he considered dangerous. Lord reactivated a Brother Eye satellite system and manipulated events to incite distrust in metahuman. 

He covertly used his powers to control minds, including that of Superman, who he turned against the League in a test of loyalty. Blue Beetle uncovered Maxwell's plot, but was unable to stop him. When Blue Beetle refused to join Lord's cause, he executed him with a gunshot to the head. 

This act set off the events of Infinite Crisis, during which Wonder Woman was forced to kill Maxwell Lord to free Superman from his control. The Justice League International era was definitively closed with Blue Beetle's death, and many of its surviving members were left shaken and disillusioned. That is, until post-Flashpoint continuity, when the United Nations again sanctioned a global superhero team after the public debut of the original Justice League. 

This time the team was formed explicitly as a counterbalance to the independent nature of the main League, with government oversight as a prerequisite. Maxwell Lord was replaced by UN director Andre Briggs, who selected Booster Gold as the team's leader due to his public appeal and historical record. Their new base of operations was the United Nations Hall of Justice, designed as a diplomatic and operational headquarters rather than a superhero hideout. The new lineup included Booster Gold, Guy Gardner, Fire Ice, Vixen, Gdiva, Red Rocket, and August General & Iron. Batman joined the team as a representative of the original Justice League, assigned to ensure that the new team would not jeopardize global security. 

While Booster was nominally in charge, Batman frequently stepped in as a de facto leader during crises. Their first major mission involved stopping the signalmen, giant alien constructs awakened by unknown forces. The League worked to neutralize the signalmen's threat and discovered their connection to an ancient interdimensional force. 

Their success led to an increase in public support, and the United Nations promoted their visibility as a deterrent against metahuman threats. The League soon faced internal strain as Gdiva and Booster clashed over leadership and media handling. The Rocket Red's armor, erratic behavior, and the August General's authoritarian tactics caused tension. Despite this, the team held together and responded to global emergencies including alien incursions, terrorism, and environmental disasters. During a mission in the country, Derain, the team was ambushed by a group of cybernetically enhanced assassins under the employee of the villain Breakdown. Rocket Red was mortally wounded and several team members were critically injured. Booster Gold was briefly presumed dead after sacrificing himself to stop a bomb. This marked the effective end of the Justice League International. 

The UN officially disbanded the group, setting its high casualty rate and public relations issues. Booster Gold later appeared, displaced in time. This future self-involved an ecober effort to prevent catastrophic events tied to the multiverse. While the Justice League International did not officially reform, its surviving members continued to collaborate during global crises and crossover events, often setting their shared past as a source of camaraderie and tactical coordination. Now for the Justice League International's seven-member roster, I decided to start with the iconic members of Booster Gold, the Blue Beetle Ted Cord, and the Green Lantern Guy Gardner, as all three of them embody the often comedic vibe of this Justice League iteration. I've also included Elogated Man, as he was a prominent member of both the Justice League Europe and Super Buddies, and to include some true international flavor, I'm including the duo of Fire and Ice, from Brazil and Norway, with Fire and Ice powers respectively. For my seventh and final member, I decided to go with Shazam, who was not only an original member, but his sister Mary-Marvel also had a presence on the Super Buddies team. So again, my roster is Booster Gold, Blue Beetle, Green Lantern, Elogated Man, Fire, Ice, and Shazam. 

I gotta say your team's history didn't seem that much better, with multiple iterations and closures and things like that. Wow, rude. I will say that the Justice League International does seem to have a more distinct personality that separates it from the primary Justice League. 

Yeah, it was definitely a much more comedic tone than the primary Justice League team, which was much more serious. 

Well, I don't think the JLI is going to have much to laugh at as they're getting their asses beat as we get into the speculation here. I do want to state that the pairings that we've decided for this matchup are Blue Beetle and Black Panther, Booster Gold and Wonder Man, Green Lantern and War Machine, Fire and Tigra, Ice and Wasp, Elogated Man and Quicksilver and Shazam and Hercules, which are pretty damn good pairings, I think. Yeah, I think this should be good. 

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Now that we got the team's histories and rosters out of the way, let's speculate on how one of the thousands of simulated matches will go. The winners determined by simulations, not our speculation, but it's fun to imagine how this fight could play out. AJ and I.K., what are the rules of our speculation? 

Environmental statistics are considered in my simulations. The teams must earn victory on their own merit. 

Alright then, let's get into it. The Justice League International and the West Coast Avengers, me on the battlefield, who goes first? 

I'm gonna say I go first. I finally get to kick things off with this Speedster character with Quicksilver. And Quicksilver starts off by just running circles around the Justice League and he creates this vortex that sucks all the year away from all of the Justice League members. And he extinguishes fires, flames, and the Justice League just passes out. 

No, I'm gonna say that before everyone passes out, ice is going to freeze the ground around them. Quicksilver to slip right into a giant green hand raising the middle finger that was generated by Guy Gardner. And actually, a bunch of giant green hands and fists are going to erupt beneath the Avengers, swatting and slapping and punching them all across the environment. Somebody saw Superman. Yeah, I did. 

Okay, so the Avengers are getting knocked around by these giant green hands, but suddenly I'm gonna say Green Lantern gets a glowing green dagger blade right through his chest. Because Black Panther used his agility to avoid the hand constructs, and then he chucked a green Vibranium energy dagger at Green Lantern, and green means it's set to stun. So Guy Gardner's stunned, he falls forward, lands right on his face, and he's passed out for the time being. And then War Machine just starts unleashing his shoulder-mounted minigun at Blue Beetle and Booster Gold, just targeting between the two of them and turning them into human Swiss cheese. 

Well, Booster Gold, you know, he'll fire up his force field to protect himself. And Blue Beetle, he's just gonna start doing backflips to dodge the gunfire. And he's gonna backflip onto a trapeze wire hanging below his bug ship, which is gonna quickly retract up and pull him into the ship before it fires this electrified net onto War Machine, and that's gonna pin him to the ground and just short-circuit his suit. So while War Machine is busy dealing with that, Booster Gold is gonna turn his attention to Wonder Man, and he's gonna blast him with an energy beam from his gauntlet. 

Who said you get the bug ship during this fight? Me! I did! 

It's Blue Beetle! I got it in the proler match! 

No, that's right, that's right. Okay, so Booster Gold shoots Wonder Man with an energy beam? Yes. I'm gonna say before he gets that shot off, all of a sudden his arm gets knocked away, and he misses. And he's like, what, what just happened? So he tries again with his other hand, and that gets knocked away too by this small beam. Booster has no idea what's happening, but then all of a sudden he gets fucking rocked in the jaw with an uppercut, and it's the wasp. And he didn't see her because she had shrunk down, and she used her stink blasts to knock Booster's arms off his aim, and then she gave him a miniature sized uppercut, but still packed with full-sized power. 

Oh, dank. Okay. Well, meanwhile, Shuzam and Hercules, they're probably wrestling, and Shuzam is like, you're Hercules? I have all of your powers! And then some. So with Hercules in a headlock, Shuzam's gonna yell out his name, and he's gonna electrocute Hercules with Azusa's lightning. 

Except at the last second, Hercules maneuvers out of the headlock, and he lifts Shuzam above his head just as the lightning strike hits, which is gonna turn Shuzam back into Billy Batson. And like, he didn't know this was gonna happen, he just thought he'd use Shuzam as a shield, but with Shuzam turned back into a kid, Hercules is gonna spin the kid around, swinging him by his ankles, and then just let go. Billy like a discus over the horizon. 

Well, after he threw Billy, I'm gonna say he didn't notice a lightning strike in the distance where Billy was thrown, and as Shuzam is racing back toward the battle, fire and ice, meanwhile, are going to be tag-teaming Tigra, just blasting her with both waves of fire and freezing hail. 

Well, wouldn't the fire melt the hail, and then the melted hail would put out the fire? No. So like, fire and ice are just cancelling their attack out, like a couple of dumbasses, and Tigra is gonna leap high up into the air, like way out of their blasts, and she's gonna land with a pounce right on top of fire, just slashing her face right off, and taking her out of the match. 

Okay, here's the thing though, once Tigra landed on fire, fire's whole body flamed up like the human torch, so Tigra essentially just sacrificed her body to eliminate fire, and with her badly burned, it's gonna leave her wide open for ice to just freeze her solid for killing her best friend. So Tigra's out now too. 

All right, but Wonder Man saw that, and he's pissed off by that, so he just flicks ice in the head, and now ice is out of the match too. Wait, what? A flick? Yeah, Wonder Man's like insanely strong, so like a flick from Wonder Man is like getting hit with a sledgehammer to the dome, so yeah, ice is out. 

Okay, well while that happened, Elongated Man noticed Quicksilver has, you know, recovered from the start of the match, and so he's going to flatten himself out along the ground of the battlefield, and as Quicksilver is zipping around, once he runs over Elongated Man, that's when his trap is going to spring, and he's folding his body around Quicksilver just suffocating him. 

Elongated Man's not gonna be able to easily restrain Quicksilver, because Quicksilver, he's gonna shake and vibrate to give himself some space within Elongated Man's trap, kind of like a rubber ball in a balloon type situation, and when he has enough space, Quicksilver's gonna spin like a cyclone with his arms out, and that's just like putting Elongated Man in a blender. 

So Elongated Man gets knocked around and twisted, and eventually he's gonna get flung away like a limp noodle, and just be on the ground reeling from getting punched like a thousand times in like 10 seconds. And while he's recovering, War Machine, he reboots his armor from getting short circuited by Blue Beetle's net, and he's gonna cut his way out of the net using a plasma cutter on his wrist, which kind of looks like a welding tool. But at that point, War Machine's gonna shoot Blue Beetle's bug ship just right out of the air with a bunch of missiles fired from his arm-mounted rocket launcher. So the bug ship gets hit, and it's gonna crash to the ground and explode, which kills Blue Beetle who's inside. 

Oh no, because like the bug ship would be alerting Blue Beetle that the missiles are coming, so Blue Beetle he'll eject from the bug ship right before it gets hit by the missiles, and as he's parachuting back to the battlefield, he's actually going to control and steer the crashing bug ship using controls and his gloves into Black Panther, and that's gonna obliterate him. 

Okay, okay. But as Blue Beetle is parachuting to the ground, all of a sudden this sword comes flying out of nowhere through the air right at him, and it's the sword of Pellius, which is Hercules Sword, Hercules threw it, and it severs Blue Beetle's parachute cords, and he falls to his death. Jeez. 

Okay, meanwhile Booster Gold, he's too distracted to notice his friend Blue Beetle's death just now, because he's been using his future tech goggles to try and find and track what hit him earlier, the wasp, and when he finally pinpoints her buzzing around the battlefield, he's gonna trap her in a tractor beam, pull her right into his fist, and that's where he's gonna crush her literally like a bug. 

Well she could just grow to get out of his fist. 

No, no, because he uses his force field energy to create tractor beams, so she can't grow out of that. Can't grow out of a force field? Right, it's like a hard light energy bubble. 

Okay, uh, well War Machine, he's using his armor's flamethrowers to just ignite elongated man, and now elongated man's out of this match. 

But no, it's not like elongated man would just sit still long enough for flamethrowers to take him out. As War Machine is trying to burn him to death, elongated man is dodging and flipping and that's when Shazam is gonna zip over to War Machine and in a blur, he's gonna yank off all of his weapons and armor before War Machine can really do anything about it. And with Rody standing there armorless, that's when Shazam's gonna grab him and just eat him right into outer space. Jesus. 

Well, elongated man may be able to dodge flamethrowers, sure, but he's not gonna dodge this sudden beam of ionic energy from Wonder Man who shoots it out of his eyes. So elongated man gets two holes just punched through his head and now he's out of the match for real this time. 

Okay, well you know who else is out of the match? Quicksilver, because green lantern is gonna generate glue all over the environment floor around Quicksilver and that's gonna slow him down long enough for green lantern to just snatch him with a giant pair of chopper cable pliers and those are gonna be connected to a giant green battery which just fries Quicksilver. 

Okay, but then, hey look Black Panther slashes his way out of the rubble of the bug ship that crashed on him. What? I mean he has vibranium mesh suit, you know, that would just absorb the impact and it's gonna like super charge him. So he slashes his way out of the rubble and he has a reed on green lantern's energy signature from his first attack against him. So he knows Green Lantern's weakness, he knows to target the ring from his Kimoyo bead readout and while Guy is distracted, frying Quicksilver, Black Panther leaps over and slashes off Green Lantern's ring with his claws and before Guy can even react, Black Panther straight up unalives the guy with a kinetic powered explosive kick right to his ribs just shattering them. 

Wait, Black Panther cut off Guy's finger? Yeah, that was actually a good move. Sucky but good. Thanks. But Guy's ring is going to seek out a new ring bearer and it's gonna choose the closest most worthy hero and I'm gonna say that's gonna be, who do I have left? Booster Gold and Shazam? I'm gonna say it's Booster Gold. So I guess he's Booster Green now with the ring and so he's gonna trap Wonder Man in this futuristic battery with cables attached to his suit and Booster Gold is going to absorb Wonder Man's ionic energy form into his suit, powering it up so Wonder Man himself is just dissipated and now charging up Booster Green. That's crazy. 

So I have Black Panther and Hercules left and Black Panther's going up against Shazam which sounds kind of one-sided but little does Shazam know that Black Panther has been recording this entire fight with his Kimoyo beads. So Black Panther slides under Shazam and one of his beads acts like a speaker and it shouts out in Billy's voice Shazam which is gonna call down the lightning and it transforms Shazam back into Billy again and just when Billy is like aw man again that's when Black Panther nerve strikes the kid to put him down. It's child abuse man. 

So you have Black Panther and Hercules left? Well my last guy, Booster Green, he's now super charged with ionic energy and he's gonna have literally no problem power boosting and converting his suit's internal time travel technology to easily snap the two Marvel guys right out of the time stream. What? Boom two birds with one stone and the end of this match. Can he do that? 

He can't transform his technology with his power ring. He literally just did but that's lame. I'm gonna say instead all of a sudden Booster Green's ring turns purple. It glows purple and cackles with this ionic energy and it shoots out a Wonder Man construct except Booster can't control it because Wonder Man's immortal you know he can't be contained so he's back like he usually comes back in the comics and in his ionic form he grabs Booster in this bear hug just crushing his suit's batteries and Booster's spine. So Wonder Man's the only one left standing and he also has this like cool purple lantern ring to boot. 

I'm sorry what the fuck just happened? 

I'm saying that Wonder Man can't be trapped within this green lantern ring. 

Whatever apparently Wonder Man is now a violet lantern of love weird. 

You know I think he'd go with that he's kind of a pacifist anyway. 

I'm gonna say fuck that and he actually could be contained in Booster's suit because it's from the future. You don't know what kind of technology it is. It could contain ionic energy. 

Then why didn't it? I'm saying it did though. I guess we'll leave it there. Yeah let's leave it there. We'll see a scenario happens either Booster Gold is able to contain Wonder Man's ionic energy form within his power battery or Wonder Man can't be contained and snaps Booster Gold into. Let's go ahead and input the team stats, run the simulations, and come back with a winner. A.J .9K hit it. 

Inputting data, running calculations, processing results, simulations complete. 

Oh this was a close one. This is pretty good. This is actually closer than the Justice League versus Avengers duel that we did way back when. That one was a little bit lopsided in favor of the Justice League but these guys were actually paired up pretty damn well. 

Yeah I mean I had the highest win rate of around 85% but I also had the weakest character surprisingly who turned out to be Ice. She won less than 20%. 

Yeah my guys weren't too far off of that like War Machine won about three fourths of all of his matches and Tigro won just under one fourth of all her matches. But regarding the teams as a whole I gotta say the Justice League International trounced the West Coast Avengers when it came to the category of range. Like you have a lot of Blasty guys on your side with Booster Gold and Green Lantern of course Fire and Ice, Shazam shoots lightning, Blue Beetle has his own blaster, Long-Aided Mannequin stretch but like guys on my side like Hercules and Tigra, Wonder Man, and Quicksilver they barely had any range. 

Yeah Wonder Man can shoot Ionic energy but it's rare. It's super rare super rare. The best thing your team had going for it was actually strength. 

Yeah I mean we have heavy hitters like Hercules, Wonder Man, War Machine, even Tigra can lift about 10 tons. She's like Spider-Man level strength whereas on your side you know elongated man's not that strong neither are Fire and Ice neither is Blue Beetle so the West Coast Avengers were able to lay the smack down in that regard. 

But were they able to lay the smack down overall or were they the ones who in fact got the smacking? Who do you think came out on top? 

It's gonna be close but I'm rooting for the Avengers because of course I am. 

Well I have to say Instagram disagrees with you by a lot. 75% of our poll takers voted in favor of the Justice League International. Well that's disappointing. That's life get used to it. It's full of disappointment for Marvel fans. 

Let's see if they're right. AG9K the results please. Here you are sir. All right the winner in the team duel between the Justice League International and the West Coast Avengers is the West Coast Avengers. West side? That's right. West side is the best side. Out of all the simulated matches between the teams the West Coast Avengers won 506 matches over the JLI's 494. 

They only won 12 more than the Justice League? This is a coin toss then. 

If by coin toss you mean the Justice League got that shit kicked out of them by the Avengers then yeah coin toss. 

If this was any other day you guys would have lost. 

But not this day. 

Not this day. This is sweet justice for the Avengers. The West Coast branch was able to redeem the Avengers brand. They're reclaiming the trophy from the Justice League and we're just running victory laps all around the fucking Justice League. I cannot even fathom these results. Like there's no way the Avengers would ever beat the Justice League. 

This is. I'm sorry they just did by 12 whole matches. 

Like I feel like I'm in an alternate reality right now. It's like what's going on? 

Well let's be frank you needed to be taken down off of your high horse Jonathan after watching the Superman movie. 

Well it's fine I'll just get back up on it after I'm gloating at the Fantastic Forest failure. 

Marvel all day every day Justice League sucks. You suck personally and I want you to remember this feeling. 

Already forgotten. But that does it for this team dual AJ9K help close us out. 

Thanks for listening to Dynamic Jewel. Visit the show's website at dynamicjewel.com and follow us on Instagram at dynamicjewel podcast. You can support the show on Patreon at patreon.com slash dynamicjewel and joining a tier that works for you or by rating and reviewing dynamic dual on Apple podcasts, Spotify, Podchaser or on our website. Don't send Joe world and console combat. 

In our next episode of course we will be reviewing the latest MCU film to hit theaters the Fantastic Four first steps. Not looking forward to it. Not hyped at all. I hope it bombs and it's already projected to open less than Superman which is freaking awesome. 

No one can predict the future but that does it for this episode. We want to give a big thanks to our team. Josh Liner, Mike Williams, Oscar Galvez and Paul Graves for helping make this podcast possible. And we'll talk to you guys next week. Up up and away true 

believers.