Legion of Superheroes vs New Mutants

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This is a DynaMic Network Podcast. Hi, welcome to
the DynaMic Dual Podcast, a weekly show where we

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review superhero films and debate the
superiority between Marvel and DC by comparing

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their characters in stat-based battle
simulations. I'm Johnny DC. And I'm his twin

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brother, Marvelous Joe. And in this episode, we
are doing another team duel, this time between the

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Legion of Superheroes and the New Mutants. Yeah,
my guys have actually had a movie. Hey, my guys have

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had a movie? What? Yeah, it was animated. Oh, yeah,
it was called the Legion of Superheroes starring

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Supergirl. That's right. And? Yeah, but it didn't
have most of the Prime Legionaries, at least like,

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you know, not the main ones like Cosmic Boy and
Saturn Girl and Lightning Lad. You know what the

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New Mutants movie did I have? What? An audience.
You're not wrong. But I thought it was a pretty

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decent film. You could listen to our review of
that. It's a great set of characters, the New

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Mutants, and a lot of them, as they've gone older,
have like powered up from their original power

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limitations. So I think this is going to be a good
match. Yeah, it's actually the same for the Legion

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of Superheroes. Both teams started off as
teenagers, but they have had some growth in the

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comics, or at least Legion would have if they
wouldn't keep rebooting themselves. Their

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background is very convoluted. But we'll get more
to that later on in this episode. Before that,

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we're going to break down the comic book movie news
from the past week, of which we have two news items.

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One is a report that was done by Variety talking
about the current state of film franchises,

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including Marvel and DC. That was pretty
interesting to read. And we also got another

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trailer for Marvel Zombies. As always, we list our
segment times in our episode description, so feel

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free to check out the show notes if you want to skip
ahead to a particular topic. Guys, our

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artificially intelligent dual simulator, AJ9K,
has a quick message for our listeners. So listen

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up. Why hello there. Do you want even more from this
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at patreon.com slash dynamicjewel. Pip pip
cheerio. Thanks AJ9K, and thanks to everyone who

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supports the podcast. Be sure to tune into the
other shows on the Dynamic podcast network this

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week, including the console combat podcast,
where hosts John and Dean simulate battles

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between popular video game characters. In
yesterday's episode, the two determined who

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would win in a rematch episode between Samono Suke
Akechi from Onimusha and Ryu Hayabusa from Ninja

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Gaiden. Over on the Max Destruction podcast,
hosts Scotty and Gilly pit your favorite action

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heroes from film and television against each
other. On Wednesday, they're going to find out

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who'd win in a fight between Adonis Creed, Apollo
Sun, and Rocky, both from the Rocky franchise. I

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don't know if I want to know the answer to that. On
the Cinger World podcast, hosts Zachary Hepburn

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speculates on fights between fan favorite anime
and manga characters. Next episode, Zach is

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reviewing the series to be hero X. Visit
dynamicpodcasts.com or click the link in our show

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notes to listen to all the shows in the Dynamic
podcast network. But with that out of the way,

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quick to the No Prize. A No Prize is an award that
Marvel used to give out to fans. Our version, the

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Dynamic Dual No Prize, is a digital award we post on
Instagram for the person that we feel gave the best

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answer to our question of the week. Last week, we
asked you guys, who do you want the villain for Man

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of Tomorrow to be and why? And of course, this is
coming off the news that the Superman movie is

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getting a sequel in 2027 titled Man of Tomorrow. We
get quite a few answers. Let's go ahead and run down

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our honorable mentions as well as the No Prize
winner. Our first honorable mention goes to

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Travis Herndon. Who said? Well, so the name of the
dude Travis here, shout out to my able twin. So my

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pick would be Matalo. I think he'd be a nice,
grounded villain for Superman's sequel. We've

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never seen him before in a live action movie. And
you could have the story be that Lex created him and

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only for him to go overboard forcing Lex and
Superman to have a very shaky alliance to take

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Matalo down. He's a very interesting bad-ass
villain, and he can be a threat to both Lex and

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Superman. So James Gunn did confirm in an
interview with Howard Stern last week that in the

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Man of Tomorrow film, Superman and Lex Luthor
would be teaming up to stop a greater threat. And I

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could see that being Matalo, especially if you go
the route that Travis mentioned, where Lex Luthor

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is responsible for his creation. But he kind of
goes against his creator and now him and Superman

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have to team up to stop what he created. Yeah, it
could be like the age of Ultron of the Superman

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franchise, right? And Matalo isn't that
powerful, but he is to Superman because he has the

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kryptonite and he can be, you know, a formidable
foe against a human like Lex Luthor. So yeah, I

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could see this and I like the idea of it. It's also
cool because we haven't seen Matalo as a villain on

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the big screen yet. So why not? Great answer,
Travis. Our next honorable mention goes to We

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Don't Know because they didn't submit their name.
But, uh, yeah, let's give it a listen. Joe, John,

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Joe, how's it going, guys? Man of Tomorrow, I
think, should have Brainiac as the villain. We've

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never really seen him in live action, at least not
done, you know, not really in a proper way. And

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given that there's going to be multiple other
superheroes, I think it's a great opportunity to

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bring in a bigger villain like that. I think it's
too early for Darkseid. But I would also like to see

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Parasite or Matalo, someone who's not just going
to be a big brute fight for Superman. Now,

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actually, Brainiac was the most common answer
that we received. And he's honestly the villain

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that I have most wanted to see Superman face. On the
big screen in like forever. Like, it still

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surprises me that we haven't seen him fight
Brainiac yet in a movie. He's such a great villain.

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Yeah, and he definitely raises the stakes enough
to warrant a Superman Lex Luthor team up. So good

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answer. Whoever you are, whoever answered, be
sure, guys, to leave your name when you leave an

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answer, either in the field to the asks for your
name or in the call itself. Our final honorable

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mention goes to Dylan DeWitt, who said, Hey, guys,
Dylan DeWitt here, big fan of the show. Thanks for

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what you guys do. Right to the chase. Man of
Tomorrow should have Brainiac as the villain. We

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haven't really had a big screen adaption of the
character. And I think that if they're going to

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have multiple characters in Lex and Superman
teaming up, then Brainiac would be the most

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obvious choice for that. I could also see Cyborg
Superman or Parasite, somebody like that. Now,

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Dylan mentioned Brainiac, but he also mentioned
Cyborg Superman, who, of course, is a villain that

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tied into Superman's death and the whole reign of
the Superman saga in the comics that I am still

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waiting to see adapted in live action. I think that
would be a fantastic film, probably not for Man of

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Tomorrow. Considering it seems like the premise
of that is that Superman and Lex are timming up. But

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maybe for the film after that, we could explore
characters like Steel, like the Eradicator, like

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Superboy and Cyborg Superman. What do you think
about Parasite as an option? I think that could be a

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good one, especially if it's like a version of
Parasite that grows big, like a Kaiju, like

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Godzilla or something like that, like how he did in
Superman, Man of Tomorrow, the animated movie.

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And Lex and Superman teamed up to stop him in that
film as well. That's true. Who knows? Maybe that's

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why the film is called Man of Tomorrow. Because
it's this straight adaptation of the animated

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film. I hope not. I did not love that film. But great
answer, Dylan. We want to give a quick shout out to

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Noah Terry and Lorenzo Valdes. But the winner of
this week's No Prize is Alex Albro, who said, Hey

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guys, this chapter really is about gods and
monsters. I think this film would be a good one to

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start to introduce villain like Perpetual and
Barbados and people like that. You know, it could

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lead eventually to a crisis storyline if you
wanted it to. But also, I think it could just get

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into the greater origin of the multiverse and make
this DC a bit more whimsical and fantastical in

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previous iterations. May not be punk rock, but it
could be metal. Is that an allusion to Dark

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Knight's Metal? Yes, of course, the characters of
Perpetua and Barbados were introduced in the Dark

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Knight's Metal comics storyline, along with the
introduction of the Dark Multiverse, which I feel

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like you can't really explain until you get into
the multiverse. Perpetua is a character that

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definitely falls within the gods and monsters
theme that James Gunn has set up for the kickoff of

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the DCU. But I do feel like it's a lot to get to. Like
the Dark Multiverse is a deep cut, as cool as it is. I

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feel like you would need a lot of setup going into
it. And James Gunn will just cover it through a

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bunch of text in the first minute of his movie.
That's all the exposition you need. Honestly, I

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kind of believe it. Now, Alex gets the win because
he gave an original answer, but also because he was

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bold enough to suggest something like Perpetua,
the creator of the DC universe itself in the

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comics. Yeah, that would be a wild battle for sure.
But congrats, Alex. You win this week's No Prize.

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If you, the listener, want a shot at winning your
own No Prize, stay tuned to later on this episode

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when we'll be asking another question of the week.
And now that that's done, on to the news. All right,

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this past week, Variety, a Hollywood news outlet,
released a report that commented on Hollywood's

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biggest franchises and where they currently
stand in comparison to the past 10 years. Marvel

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and DC were highlighted in this report, as well as
other popular franchises like James Bond and Star

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Wars, the Jurassic Park movies, Mission
Impossible, Hunger Games and Star Trek. It was

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interesting to see how specifically the MCU and
the DC franchises currently compare to how they

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have in the 20 teens. They have a lot of
infographics up on there, so I'm going to try to do

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my best to explain it, but overall, the state of
Marvel is that while the Marvel franchise

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currently has the biggest share of market
saturation out of all the franchises, just

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because of all the content that Disney is putting
out there with Marvel. Marvel is actually

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slipping compared to the 20 teens in that their box
offices are going down. However, fortunately,

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the report says that because Marvel's budgets are
also going down, that the return on Marvel's films

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is staying relatively level. Yeah, they don't
have to pay Robert Downey Jr. anymore. Oh, wait.

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Yeah. But the report comments that the Avengers
movie is basically bulletproof. It's going to

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make a load of money, but they could also signal to
moviegoers that they can afford to skip the

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in-between films and just stick around for the
Avengers movies. Right. Especially this go

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around because it doesn't seem like there was too
much setup for the Avengers, at least compared to

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the films in the last decade. Right. Now, whereas
Marvel had more commercial potential, DC had more

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creative health, in surprise to no one. Of course,
that has a lot to do with James Gunn, who jumped ship

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from Marvel to DC. And we're going to see just how
much influence apparently James Gunn had on

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Marvel now that he's gone and is ramping up the DC
universe on screen. His Superman movie did

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fantastic out the gate. Not only was it a critical
success, but it was also a commercial success, at

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least domestically. But then again, DC is also
making inroads in the global box office as well,

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according to this report. Yeah. When you compare
the box office return of the Superman movie that

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came out this year to the past 10 years of DC films,
yet DC's box office is up currently, as well as

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their return on budget, because Superman was made
for a little bit less than what they were making the

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previous DC movies. So everything is looking
great for DC right now. The state of the franchise

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is in good shape. And Marvel is looking a little bit
shaky. But then again, we all know that the

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Avengers is going to make a billion dollars and
Marvel is going to take back its crown at the

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movies. I feel like I heard that exact same thing
when you were talking about Fantastic Four, which

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you owe me money, motherfucker. You don't know
that yet. Fantastic Four has not exited theaters

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yet. So we'll talk then. We know. We know there's no
way it's going to catch up. Anyway, on the topic of

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film franchises, that brings us to our question of
the week. Besides Marvel and DC, what is your

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favorite film franchise of all time? And why?
Record your answer at dynamicdool.com by

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clicking on the red microphone button in the
bottom right hand corner of the screen, which will

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prompt you to leave us a voicemail. Your message
could be up to 30 seconds long. And don't forget to

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leave your name in case we include you on the
podcast. We'll pick our favorite answer and award

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that person a dynamic dual no prize that will post
to Instagram. Be sure to answer before September

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20th. In other Marvel news, we got the second
trailer for the upcoming Marvel Zombies animated

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series. It's actually a mini series. It's only
four episodes that's going to start streaming on

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September 24th. The last trailer we got was Off the
Wall bonkers, insane and so damn cool with the

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soundtrack and everything like that. This second
trailer takes things a little bit more epic and

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serious. A lot of the first episode looks like it's
going to play out exactly like the World War Z movie

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where we see Shang-Chi and Katie in the streets of
San Francisco fleeing from the zombie outbreak.

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And you have like a bunch of zombies like leaping
off buildings and shit to try to eat people. It

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looks like absolute madness. And I'm totally here
for it because they didn't really show too many of

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those scenes in the what if Marvel Zombies
episode. You know, it was more of like a slow build,

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more of like a night of the living dead as opposed to
a World War Z. And I really like the apocalyptic

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approach that World War Z took to the start of its
zombie apocalypse. It does look like some of these

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zombies gain sentience and can talk, which of
course is true to the Marvel Zombies comic book

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series where the zombies could reason and talk.
And that's really what made them so dangerous. And

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eventually the Marvel Zombies ended up taking
over the whole universe and spreading into the

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multiverse. Yeah, that's interesting. I like the
way that this trailer kind of sets up a little bit of

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who the good guys are and who the bad guys are. We
definitely know some of the good guys are going to

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probably be zombified, but it's going to be
interesting to see which one survive. Yeah, it

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looks like an all out war between the last
remaining survivors and the legions of undead

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that come after them, which is not a common
approach in zombie films. You don't usually see

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like battle fronts of zombies against survivors.
I think it's going to be pretty interesting,

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though. Really looking forward to seeing how this
plays out. It's going to be a great time this

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Halloween season, which is quickly approaching
us. And as we said last time, we won't be reviewing

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the miniseries, but we will definitely be
discussing our thoughts on it in this show. But

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that does it for all of the news for this episode. So
let's go ahead and move on to our main event, which

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is the team duel between DC's Legion of
Superheroes from the 31st century and the new

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mutants from the 21st century. All right, Legion
of Superheroes versus the new mutants, as we

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explained earlier, these are both super teams of
young heroes who are kind of fulfilling a legacy.

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In regards to the Legion, who exist in the 31st
century, it's the legacy of the superheroes of the

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21st century. And for the new mutants, it's the
legacy of the X-Men. Yeah, they have that theme in

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common, I guess, the same way that young justice
and the young Avengers do. That was a previous duel

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episode that we did. But the new mutants are
decades older than the young Avengers team. Same

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with the Legion of Superheroes. I think these
teams first debuted like back in the 80s and 70s, if

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I'm not mistaken. It was actually the 1950s for the
Legion. Whoa, OK, yeah, well, the new mutants were

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the 80s. I thought the Legion just went back to the
70s, but I was wrong. The 50s, that is an old team,

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and they've probably been rebooted once per
decade since their inception. Too many times, way

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too many times. I try to make sense of it for my write
up on their history. But yeah, they've gone

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through more reboots than the DC universe has for
sure. Well, the future is always changing, right?

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So maybe that makes sense. I think that's how they
justify it. Well, let's get into these teams' back

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stories. First, to explain the methodology
behind our duels, let's go to our sentient duel

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simulator, Alfred Jarvis 9000, AJ9K tell our
listeners how you go about determining a winner in

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our duel matchups. Yes, of course, sir. The way I
determine a winner between the two teams is by

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running one thousand Monte Carlo simulations
between every character on each team using their

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statistics. A Monte Carlo simulation is a
probabilistic model used to determine outcomes

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through random sampling. In this case, I
randomize the statistics along a normal

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distribution as a way to simulate the many
variables that can occur during battle. The stat

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parameters are based on the official Marvel power
grid from which the DC characters statistics are

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extrapolated. Additional stat categories are
included such as range, damage potential,

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versatility and perception in order to create a
more detailed and accurate simulation. The

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results of the 49,000 simulations provide a
percentage of wins for each character on both

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teams. The team with the higher average win rate is
declared the victor as they have a higher

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probability to win any given battle. In an
equitable pairing, neither team should win 100%

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of the matches. The comic book stories have shown
that there's even a way for Batman to defeat

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Superman, so the confidence rate of my method
falls in line with the precedents that have been

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established in the source material. My
mathematical simulations are without

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subjectivity or bias. Feats are not the sole
consideration, nor are fan votes tabulated for

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determination of the winner. Thanks, AJ9K.
Before we run the simulations, though, we'd like

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to break down each team's histories and rosters
before improvising a scenario on how we imagine

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one of the thousands of simulations would play out
beat for beat. And I believe it's my turn to go first

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with the Marvel team backstory. So let me tell you
all about the new mutants. The new mutants were

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assembled when Professor Charles Xavier
believed his X-Men had died battling the alien

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brood. You can learn more about the X-Men in our
Titans vs. X-Men duel episode. Though despondent

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and unwilling to endanger more children, Xavier
was persuaded by Dr. Moira MacTagger to train

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young mutants so they would not face threats
alone. He first recruited John Coyman, aka Karma,

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a Vietnamese refugee who could possess others'
minds. She was soon joined by Reigns and Claire,

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aka Wolfsbane, recruited from a mob in Scotland,
and Danielle Moonstar, a Cheyenne girl with the

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ability to project illusions of people's fears
and desires. From Brazil, they brought in Roberto

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D'Acasda, aka Sunspot, who could draw power from
sunlight, while in Kentucky, they encountered

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Sam Guthrie, aka Cannonball, who could propel
himself in an impenetrable shield. At Xavier's

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School for Gifted Youngsters, the new mutants
trained in the use of their newfound abilities

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while adjusting to life as students and young
heroes. They battled government agents from

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Project Wide awake in their sentinels and
confronted Xavier himself after his infection by

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a brood embryo compelled him to manipulate the new
mutants into becoming hosts. With the X-Men's

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return from space, both teams fought together to
save Xavier, ultimately restoring his mind to a

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new body. The new mutants then continued their
training alongside their X-Men mentors. You can

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learn more about Professor X and his duel against
the Doom Patrol's chief. The new mutants faced

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personal and supernatural challenges. Karma
went missing during a battle against Viper and

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Silver Samurai, leaving the others to press on
under Moonstar's reluctant leadership. They

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encountered Cloak and Dagger, fought criminals
in Brazil, and traveled to Nova Roma in the Amazon,

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where they met Amara Akila. After awakening her
ability to control molten rock, she became Magma

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and joined the team. Around this time, Ileana
Rasputin, aka Magic, the younger sister of

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Colossus, reappeared from the dimension of Limbo
as a sorceress now armed with the Soul Sword. She

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also became a full member of the new mutants, now
wielding dark magical powers in addition to her

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teleportation abilities. The new mutants' first
rivalry emerged with the creation of the Helians,

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a separate mutant school trained by Emma Frost at
the Massachusetts Academy. You can learn more

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about Emma Frost in our Poison Ivy vs. White Queen
duel episode. During an attempt to rescue Kitty

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Pryde and Doug Ramsey, both of whom were captured
by Emma Frost, the new mutants discovered Doug was

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a mutant with the ability to decipher any
language. Taking the code name Cypher, he joined

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the team. Soon after, the techno-organic alien
Warlock arrived on Earth, fleeing his father.

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Warlock was accepted into the team, bonding
closely with Cypher, who was able to use his power

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to communicate with the alien. Together, the
team's growing roster faced mystical menaces

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such as the Demon Bear, which hospitalized
Moonstar until Magic slew it with her Soul Sword.

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They also fought and defeated the
human-slash-alien villain known as Hybrid,

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alongside Rom the Space Knight. Karma eventually
resurfaced after being possessed by the Shadow

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King, and the new mutants fought to free her from
his control. Their lives became increasingly

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tied to supernatural realms when the Enchantress
captured them in Asgard. Scattered across that

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realm, the members endured personal trials.
Wolf's Pain fell for the Wolf Prince, Krimhari.

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Magma was enchanted by fairies. Cannonball
labored among dwarves. Sunspot joined the

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Warriors 3, and Moonstar bonded with the steed,
Brightwind, becoming a Valkyrie. Eventually

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reunited, the new mutants returned to Earth with
lasting changes, particularly Moonstar's new

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role. You can learn more about the Enchantress and
Asgard in our Enchantress vs Enchantress duel

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episode. When Xavier departed for space with
Flaundra, the leader of the Shiar alien race,

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Magneto assumed leadership of the school. The new
mutants were wary of being taught by their former

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enemy, but gradually gave him a chance. Magneto
proved effective, even harsh, but tragedy struck

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when the beyonder erased and resurrected the team
as emotionless slaves, leaving the students with

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deep trauma. Ammafrost exploited this despair by
manipulating Magneto into sending them to her

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academy, where they underwent therapy and
returned to Xavier's school more resilient. As

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tensions grew under Magneto's leadership, the
team disobeyed him to investigate Birdbrain, an

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experimental creature tied to the villain
Animator. In the battle that followed, Doug

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Ramsey, Cypher, was shot and killed while saving
Wolf's Pain. His loss devastated the new mutants

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profoundly, with Warlock not understanding
human death, actually trying to bring Cypher back

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by using his shapeshifting ability to animate his
corpse. Ultimately, Cypher was buried and his

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friends said goodbye. Magics struggle with her
demonic nature worsened as Limbo became

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corrupted by the demon Sim, culminating in her
transformation into the Dark Child during a

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demonic invasion of New York. To end the crisis,
she sacrificed herself by erasing her older self

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from existence, reverting to childhood and
leaving the team without her. The new mutants'

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relationship with Magneto deteriorated further
as he aligned with the Hellfire Club, a secretive

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and influential society of wealthy elites who
manipulate political and economic power while

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secretly advancing their own mutant-dominated
agenda. Seeking independence from Magneto, the

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students attempted to function without him.
During the X-Men's apparent death and battle with

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the adversary, the new mutants drifted into
darker paths. They were drawn toward the nation of

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Genosha, where Cameron Hodge, a mutant bigot and
leader of an organization called the Right, was

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dedicated to exterminating mutants with
advanced technology. In the conflict, Warlock

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was killed and his and Cypher's remnants were
absorbed into one of Hodge's technological

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creations. When freed, the two were merged into
one being, which called itself Duglock. Will

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Spain left the new mutants after being
genetically altered by the Right, and Sunspot

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inherited his father's multinational company.
With their ranks depleted, the team was reforged

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under the leadership of Cable, a time-traveling
soldier who trained them for war. Alongside Boom

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Boom, Domino, Shatterstar, Warpath, and Feral,
the new mutants evolved into X-Force, abandoning

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their old team identity. You can learn more about
X-Force in their duel against the outsiders.

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Years later, the new mutants' concept returned at
Xavier School. Danielle Moonstar recruited new

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students including Wind Dancer, Wither,
Prodigy, Elixir, Wallflower, and Surge. Karma

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and Wolfsbane served as faculty. This second new
mutant squad trained alongside their rival

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Helians, clashing during competitions and
crises. Relationships among them grew

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complicated and following the elimination of
most of the mutant population's powers by the

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Scarlet Witch, the squads were disbanded. Only a
handful retained their powers, joining a single

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junior X-Men team. You can learn more about the
Scarlet Witch in her duel against Zatana. The

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original new mutants eventually reunited as an
independent team of X-Men. They faced the

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00:25:50,950 --> 00:25:56,270
Hellfire Club's Black Queen, Selene, and her
resurrected Legion of Undead Mutants. They

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defended the X-Men's San Franciscan base against
Bastion's human council and dealt with Norman

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Osborn's regime. You can learn more about Bastion
and Norman Osborn in their respective duels

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against Amazo and the Joker. Internal divisions
reflected the greater schism within the X-Men, as

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Cannonball and Karma sided with Wolverine at the
Jean Grey School in New York while the majority of

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the new mutants remained with Cyclops in San
Francisco. They took on new members including

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00:26:23,310 --> 00:26:29,370
Blink, X-Man, and Fawc villains such as Sugarman
and the Elder Gods of Limbo. When the mutants

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established a nation on the Sentient Island of
Cracow, the new mutants joined with the rest of

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their kind. Many of the new mutants who had
previously perished such as Cipher and Warlock

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00:26:39,270 --> 00:26:45,010
were revived using the island's resurrection
protocols. Reunited, the new mutants lived on the

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Academos habitat, taking on roles as teachers and
mentors. Sunspot and Moonstar recruited Magic,

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Karma, Wolfsbane, Cipher, Chamber, and Mondo for
a mission to Shiar space to retrieve Cannonball.

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Their involvement led them to interstellar
intrigue battling the Shiar. Back on Cracow, they

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00:27:02,290 --> 00:27:08,210
guided students such as Armor, Glob Herman,
Maxime, and Manon who dubbed themselves the Lost

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00:27:08,210 --> 00:27:13,590
Club. Under Magic and Moonstar, the new team
served as a training squad for younger mutants, a

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00:27:13,590 --> 00:27:18,790
reminder of the legacy of Xavier's youngest
heroes. And that's the new mutant's backstory.

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For the seven-member duel, I'll be starting with
Mirage, Sunspot, and Magic, all of whom we've done

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duels with against Arrowette, Starfire, and
Deadband respectively. Filling out the other

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00:27:28,570 --> 00:27:33,570
four spots will be the new mutants members,
Wolfsbane, who can transform into a large wolf

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00:27:33,570 --> 00:27:37,970
with increased strength, speed, and healing
factor, enhanced senses, and sharp fangs and

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00:27:37,970 --> 00:27:43,370
claws. Next is Cannonball, who can surround
himself with a propulsive thermochemical energy

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00:27:43,370 --> 00:27:48,190
called a blast field that makes him
indestructible while flying. He could also emit

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00:27:48,190 --> 00:27:53,550
this energy from his body as shockwaves or
directional blasts. Next is Magma, who can

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mentally control molten rock beneath the Earth's
surface to create volcanic or seismic activity.

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She could also transform her body into lava and
project molten rock and harden it to stone. My last

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00:28:04,510 --> 00:28:10,870
member is Cypher, but merged with Warlock. Cypher
has the ability to communicate and translate any

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00:28:10,870 --> 00:28:15,610
language, including body language, which he can
use to anticipate opponents' attacks. He could

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00:28:15,610 --> 00:28:21,250
also shapeshift given Warlock's techno-organic
nanophysiology and can also control and absorb

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technology and can convert organic tissue on
contact into technology that he can then control.

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And that's my roster to reiterate its mirage,
sunspot, magic, wolf spane, cannonball, magma,

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and Cypher merged with Warlock. Okay, so to
clarify, Warlock is inside of Cypher? Yeah, due to

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00:28:43,470 --> 00:28:49,790
Cypher's ability to communicate with Warlock,
they are able to merge together to combine their

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00:28:49,790 --> 00:28:55,070
powers essentially. It gives Cypher an actual
offensive ability besides just, you know,

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translating languages. Traditionally, when
they're merged, they've been called Douglock,

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00:28:59,270 --> 00:29:04,430
but that was actually when Warlock was taking on
Cypher's form. And Warlock didn't have any memory

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00:29:04,430 --> 00:29:10,870
of who he was as an alien. But in the modern era, when
Cypher was revived, the two kind of teamed up,

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where it's Cypher's body with Warlock's added
powers. So I'm not calling the character

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00:29:15,990 --> 00:29:20,690
Douglock, I'm just calling him Cypher. So what I'm
hearing is that you're trying to cheat by

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00:29:20,690 --> 00:29:26,630
introducing an eighth member by having one be
inside of the other. No, what I'm trying to do is

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00:29:26,630 --> 00:29:33,250
make Cypher, who was one of the early New Mutants
characters, able to stand up to Brainiac Five, who

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00:29:33,250 --> 00:29:38,090
is his counterpart on the Legion of Superheroes
team. Gotcha. We'll get more to the counterparts

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00:29:38,090 --> 00:29:44,710
once I reveal my roster. Before that, let me go over
the Legion of Superheroes backstory. In the 30th

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century, a united interstellar government known
as the United Planets was formed to preserve peace

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00:29:50,390 --> 00:29:57,230
across the galaxy. During a political summit,
three superpowered teenagers, Rock Crinn of

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00:29:57,230 --> 00:30:04,530
Braal, Garth Rands of Winneth, and Irma Ardine of
Titan thwarted an assassination attempt on

326
00:30:04,530 --> 00:30:11,390
industrialist RJ Brand, a vocal proponent of
intergalactic cooperation. Inspired by the

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00:30:11,390 --> 00:30:16,830
legendary superheroes of Earth's past, Brand
encouraged the trio to form a team of young

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00:30:16,830 --> 00:30:23,030
champions who would promote unity and defend the
United Planets. Taking the codename's Cosmic

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00:30:23,030 --> 00:30:29,550
Boy, Lightning Lad, and Saturn Girl, the three
founded the Legion of Superheroes. The team's

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00:30:29,550 --> 00:30:34,050
earliest missions were coordinated from a
rocket-shaped clubhouse on Earth with strict

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00:30:34,050 --> 00:30:40,150
membership requirements. Each hero had to
possess one unique superpower. They quickly

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00:30:40,150 --> 00:30:45,450
recruited other youths from across the galaxy,
including Brainiac Five, Chameleon Boy,

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00:30:45,450 --> 00:30:53,150
Triplicate Girl, Phantom Girl, Colossal Boy, and
more. Through time travel, they saved Superboy in

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00:30:53,150 --> 00:30:59,510
the 20th century and he joined the Legion as an
honorary member, followed later by Supergirl and

335
00:30:59,510 --> 00:31:05,550
Monal of Daxam, a former sister planet of Krypton.
You can learn more about Supergirl in our

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00:31:05,550 --> 00:31:11,630
Supergirl vs Captain Marvel duel episode. As the
team grew in reputation and size, they became

337
00:31:11,630 --> 00:31:17,470
official peacekeepers of the United Planets,
operating with support from the science police.

338
00:31:17,470 --> 00:31:21,590
Their base of operations evolved into a
technologically advanced headquarters in

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00:31:21,590 --> 00:31:27,750
Metropolis and leadership responsibilities
began rotating among members. Subteams emerged,

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00:31:27,750 --> 00:31:33,470
including the Legion Espionage Squad and the
Legion of Substitute Heroes. They faced enemies

341
00:31:33,470 --> 00:31:39,490
such as the Fatal Five, the Dark Circle, and the
Sorcerer Mordru, and suffered tragedy with the

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00:31:39,490 --> 00:31:45,510
death of founding member Lightning Lad and the
sacrifice of... The Legion endured numerous

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00:31:45,510 --> 00:31:51,670
galactic conflicts including the Earth War with
the Coons and the Great Darkness Saga, which saw

344
00:31:51,670 --> 00:31:57,650
them battle the God-like Dark Side. Though they
ultimately repelled his invasion, they lost many

345
00:31:57,650 --> 00:32:03,090
members doing so. In the aftermath, the Legion
restructured internally, held elections for

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00:32:03,090 --> 00:32:09,370
leadership, and began recruiting non-humanoid
members such as Telus and Quistlet. After the

347
00:32:09,370 --> 00:32:14,350
crisis on Infinite Earths altered the time
stream, the original history of Superboy was

348
00:32:14,350 --> 00:32:19,730
erased. It was revealed that the Superboy who had
joined the Legion came from a pocket dimension

349
00:32:19,730 --> 00:32:26,150
created by the Time Trapper to preserve their
continuity. After this Superboy died in battle,

350
00:32:26,150 --> 00:32:31,950
Manel was retconned into the role of the Legion's
inspirational figure, and the team continued its

351
00:32:31,950 --> 00:32:37,610
mission. Following the Magic Wars, the United
Planets descended into disarray. Earth was

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00:32:37,610 --> 00:32:43,730
covertly conquered by the Dominators, prompting
the disbandment of the Legion. Years later,

353
00:32:43,730 --> 00:32:49,090
Chameleon Boy secretly assembled a new, more
pragmatic version of the team to resist. The

354
00:32:49,090 --> 00:32:54,290
clandestine operation confronted covert
threats and political machinations, including a

355
00:32:54,290 --> 00:32:59,930
battle between the Sorcerers Mordru and Glorath
over control of the time stream. During this

356
00:32:59,930 --> 00:33:06,830
period, a hidden chamber beneath the Time
Institute was discovered, containing Batch SW6,

357
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teenage duplicates of the Legion who believed
themselves to be the originals. These younger

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00:33:12,030 --> 00:33:17,190
heroes formed their own version of the Legion, as
the older team fought to prevent the collapse of

359
00:33:17,190 --> 00:33:22,330
their reality. The Legion's fate was sealed
during the Zero Hour Crisis when the Time Trapper

360
00:33:22,330 --> 00:33:28,090
revealed that the SW6 Legionnaires were not
clones, but younger versions pulled from a

361
00:33:28,090 --> 00:33:33,810
divergent timeline, as reality destabilized
both the original Legion and their younger

362
00:33:33,810 --> 00:33:39,110
counterparts merged in an attempt to preserve the
time stream, effectively ending their

363
00:33:39,110 --> 00:33:45,790
continuity. In a rebooted timeline, the Legion
was reimagined once more. Still inspired by the

364
00:33:45,790 --> 00:33:52,430
trio's rescue of RJ Brand, this incarnation
emphasized diplomacy and unity among worlds. The

365
00:33:52,430 --> 00:33:57,250
founding members, Livewire, Cosmic Boy, and
Saturn Girl built a team that included updated

366
00:33:57,250 --> 00:34:03,770
versions of familiar faces like apparition,
invisible kid, excess, and Andromeda. They

367
00:34:03,770 --> 00:34:08,469
earned the trust of the United Planets through key
missions against white triangle Daxomite

368
00:34:08,469 --> 00:34:14,650
supremacists, the terrorist network Tangleweb,
and corrupt political figures such as President

369
00:34:14,650 --> 00:34:20,830
Chu. After a devastating encounter with the alien
collective known as the Blight, a spatial rift

370
00:34:20,830 --> 00:34:26,969
opened during a mission pulling half of the Legion
into an unknown universe. Presumed dead by those

371
00:34:26,969 --> 00:34:31,969
who remained, the missing members found
themselves trapped by a deranged god called the

372
00:34:31,969 --> 00:34:38,690
Progenitor, later revealed to be Element Lad,
driven mad by isolation and unchecked power over

373
00:34:38,690 --> 00:34:44,389
centuries. Livewire ultimately gave his life to
prevent the cosmic entity Omni-Phaegos from

374
00:34:44,389 --> 00:34:49,710
invading their home. The surviving Legionnaires
eventually returned to their universe only to

375
00:34:49,710 --> 00:34:55,830
discover Earth in ruins, the Legion disbanded,
and their reputation shattered. Undeterred,

376
00:34:55,830 --> 00:35:01,310
they reassembled and established a new orbital
headquarters known as Legion World. From there,

377
00:35:01,310 --> 00:35:06,430
the team fought off invasions from Robotica, who
sought to impose forced evolution through a

378
00:35:06,430 --> 00:35:11,530
process called hypertaxis, and defended the
galaxy from threats like a mind-controlled

379
00:35:11,530 --> 00:35:17,910
warworld. Brainiac 5 ultimately defeated
Robotica's leader, Computo, by allowing him to

380
00:35:17,910 --> 00:35:24,050
evolve beyond conquest. The Legion continued to
grow, launching the Legion core and contending

381
00:35:24,050 --> 00:35:29,970
with threats like Universo and Ra-Sel Ghul, the
latter of whom impersonated President Leland

382
00:35:29,970 --> 00:35:35,250
Macaulay in an effort to accelerate humanity's
evolution. The team narrowly averted

383
00:35:35,250 --> 00:35:40,930
catastrophe when Darkseid attempted to merge
with his younger self to dominate time itself, and

384
00:35:40,930 --> 00:35:46,890
later faced the fatal 500, an army of villains from
across the universe. Following the Flashpoint

385
00:35:46,890 --> 00:35:53,470
event, Legion members Wildfire, Dawnstar,
Tyrock, Timberwolf, Telus, Gates, and Chameleon

386
00:35:53,470 --> 00:36:04,870
Girl were stranded in the Nile 8 their own
timeline. While working to contain the virus,

387
00:36:04,870 --> 00:36:09,550
they encountered the Black Razors and Martian
Manhunter, who warned them they could never

388
00:36:09,550 --> 00:36:14,850
return home. You can learn more about Martian
Manhunter in our Martian Manhunter vs. Vision

389
00:36:14,850 --> 00:36:20,590
episode. Meanwhile, in the 31st century, the rest
of the Legion carried on until a devastating

390
00:36:20,590 --> 00:36:26,130
battle with the Fatal 5 forced the United Planets
to disband the team. Scattered, many

391
00:36:26,130 --> 00:36:30,730
Legionnaires returned to their home worlds, some
joining the Science Police, while others

392
00:36:30,730 --> 00:36:37,290
retired. A few, like Brainiac 5, continued their
work in secret. The team reunited when a cosmic

393
00:36:37,290 --> 00:36:43,130
entity named Infinitus threatened the
multiverse. Brainiac 5 resumed leadership, and

394
00:36:43,130 --> 00:36:48,230
the lost Legionnaires were reintegrated into the
team. They were joined by Legionnaires from

395
00:36:48,230 --> 00:36:55,130
alternate timelines, including Xs and Gates from
Earth 247. After defeating Infinitus, the Legion

396
00:36:55,130 --> 00:37:01,750
reestablished itself as an intergalactic,
peacekeeping force aware of the multiverse. In a

397
00:37:01,750 --> 00:37:08,310
newly converged future, the Legion was born anew
in the 31st century of Earth Prime. In this world,

398
00:37:08,310 --> 00:37:13,210
society had grown sterile and repressive,
discouraging physical contact, individual

399
00:37:13,210 --> 00:37:19,070
thought, and free expression. Children were
tracked, monitored, and trained to conform.

400
00:37:19,070 --> 00:37:24,710
Against this backdrop, a small group of teen
heroes defied cultural norms and formed a new

401
00:37:24,710 --> 00:37:31,270
Legion of Superheroes, inspired by the long lost
example of Superman. This new Legion expanded its

402
00:37:31,270 --> 00:37:36,130
mission beyond defense into cultural
revolution. Thousands of young idealists

403
00:37:36,130 --> 00:37:42,490
rallied to their cause as Legionnaires, while the
core team, featuring Cosmic Boy, Lightning Glad,

404
00:37:42,490 --> 00:37:48,450
Saturn Girl, Brainiac 5, Ultra Boy, Shadow Lasts,
and Timberwolf, fought authoritarian

405
00:37:48,450 --> 00:37:54,570
governments like Terror of Ferma and subversive
figures like Lemnos. Supergirl briefly joined

406
00:37:54,570 --> 00:38:00,010
them due to a temporal displacement, while
Dreamgirl became a martyr whose cryptic visions

407
00:38:00,010 --> 00:38:06,090
had guided the team's broader purpose. After a
brutal war with the Dominators, the Legion used a

408
00:38:06,090 --> 00:38:12,350
massive Phantom Zone projector to exile an entire
planet in order to save the galaxy. When Cosmic Boy

409
00:38:12,350 --> 00:38:18,070
mysteriously vanished, Supergirl and later
Lightning Glad stepped up to lead the Legion. The

410
00:38:18,070 --> 00:38:24,430
team endured internal rifts, external sabotage,
and future-born invasions. Eventually, they

411
00:38:24,430 --> 00:38:29,150
discovered that the United Planets had been
infiltrated by Rosal Ghul and his army of

412
00:38:29,150 --> 00:38:35,150
genetically engineered teleporters. Ros sought
to trigger Max hypertaxis on Earth by using the

413
00:38:35,150 --> 00:38:41,470
Moon as a catalyst. The Legion and allies defeated
him and restored the Moon to its rightful orbit.

414
00:38:41,470 --> 00:38:46,570
The most recent incarnation of the team formed
when the Legion traveled back to the 21st century

415
00:38:46,570 --> 00:38:53,770
to recruit John Kent, Superman's son, into their
ranks. This roster introduced new members like

416
00:38:53,770 --> 00:38:59,790
Gold Lantern, Dr. Fate, and Monster Boy, while
reinventing similar characters with fresh

417
00:38:59,790 --> 00:39:05,210
origins and updated abilities. And that's their
history so far. Now when choosing who would

418
00:39:05,210 --> 00:39:10,910
represent the Legion of Superheroes for this
roster, I decided to start my 7-member roster with

419
00:39:10,910 --> 00:39:17,230
the team's 3 founders. Cosmic Boy, the team's
magnetic field manipulator and founding leader

420
00:39:17,230 --> 00:39:23,950
who can control metal, produce force fields, and
generate EMP blasts. Saturn Girl, a powerful

421
00:39:23,950 --> 00:39:30,390
telepath from Titan, able to read and influence
minds. And Lightning Glad, who wields

422
00:39:30,390 --> 00:39:36,130
devastating electrical power. Other prominent
members across the Legion's history on my team are

423
00:39:36,130 --> 00:39:42,530
Brainiac 5, the 12th level intellect who provides
unparalleled strategy and advanced tech,

424
00:39:42,530 --> 00:39:48,630
primarily a force field generator. And Chameleon
Boy, a shapeshifting master of infiltration,

425
00:39:48,630 --> 00:39:54,270
deception, and surprise attacks. To represent
the diverse and sometimes outright bonkers

426
00:39:54,270 --> 00:40:00,850
Legionnaires that make the Legion unique amongst
other DC teams, I decided to add Bouncing Boy to my

427
00:40:00,850 --> 00:40:06,450
roster who can inflate his rubberized body,
allowing him to ricochet at high speeds and

428
00:40:06,450 --> 00:40:11,770
turning his body into a human wrecking ball.
Finally, to represent the team's history with

429
00:40:11,770 --> 00:40:18,130
Superman and his family, I'm adding Supergirl,
who of course possesses all of the powers of her

430
00:40:18,130 --> 00:40:23,950
cousin. All Legionnaires wear Legion Flight
Rings, which grant them high speed flights,

431
00:40:23,950 --> 00:40:30,270
environmental protection, such as in space, and
instant communication across fast distances.

432
00:40:30,270 --> 00:40:36,230
And that's the Legion. To reiterate, my team
consists of Cosmic Boy, Saturn Girl, Lightning

433
00:40:36,230 --> 00:40:43,810
Glad, Brainiac 5, Chameleon Boy, Bouncing Boy,
and Supergirl. Yeah, I like that team. I like its

434
00:40:43,810 --> 00:40:50,730
diverse roster. What is the deal with all of the
Legionnaires' names either ending in Boy, Girl,

435
00:40:50,730 --> 00:40:57,150
Lad, or Lass? That was only really during the first
wave of Legionnaires, I feel, because later on you

436
00:40:57,150 --> 00:41:03,470
get characters like Excess and Dramata. Should be
called Excess Boy and Dramata Girl, I feel like.

437
00:41:03,470 --> 00:41:08,230
Otherwise it doesn't feel like a Legionnaire
name. Is this why Livewire changed his name to

438
00:41:08,230 --> 00:41:13,490
Lightning Glad? Well, it was Lightning Glad, then
it was Livewire, then I believe his sister took on

439
00:41:13,490 --> 00:41:18,590
the name Livewire, then he was back to being
Lightning Glad and in another reboot, it's

440
00:41:18,590 --> 00:41:23,930
complicated. I think Brainiac 5 should change his
name to Brainiac 5 Boy. I think you should change

441
00:41:23,930 --> 00:41:31,710
your name to Marvelous Boy. Wait, that's weird. So
as we've mentioned earlier, whenever we're

442
00:41:31,710 --> 00:41:37,730
coming up with these team battles, we don't really
know too much about the other team. So to make this

443
00:41:37,730 --> 00:41:44,230
as fair a battle as we can make it, we like to match up
individual characters on each roster who have a

444
00:41:44,230 --> 00:41:48,850
comparable power level that we're aware of. Yeah,
in this instance for this team duel, we're pairing

445
00:41:48,850 --> 00:41:55,810
up the characters of Supergirl and Magic, who are
badass warrior types, Cosmic Boy and Sunspot, who

446
00:41:55,810 --> 00:42:01,330
wield spectral energies, Saturn Girl and Mirage,
the resident psychics of the group, Bouncing Boy

447
00:42:01,330 --> 00:42:06,450
and Cannonball, who can launch themselves and
slam into other characters, Chameleon Boy and

448
00:42:06,450 --> 00:42:12,850
Wolfsbane, who can transform their bodies,
Brainiac 5 and Cipher, the resident tech smart

449
00:42:12,850 --> 00:42:18,590
guys, and Lightning Glad and Magma, who wield
elemental energies. Notice that none of the

450
00:42:18,590 --> 00:42:24,890
members on my team have the words boy or lass or lad
in them. No, but they would be so much cooler they

451
00:42:24,890 --> 00:42:57,530
did like Magic class, Sunspot boy, Mirage girl,
heck yeah. Dynamic duel, where comic book titans

452
00:42:57,530 --> 00:43:04,070
smash every Tuesday, Max Destruction, where TV
and action heroes battle every Wednesday, and

453
00:43:04,070 --> 00:43:10,230
Sendro World, where anime champions clash every
Thursday. Join us as we speculate on the matches

454
00:43:10,230 --> 00:43:14,730
and armed with the power of mathematical
simulations, discover who will emerge

455
00:43:14,730 --> 00:43:24,930
victorious. Visit dynamicpodcast.com where we
settle the debate and settle the score. But now

456
00:43:24,930 --> 00:43:29,350
that we've got their histories and rosters out of
the way, let's speculate on how one of the

457
00:43:29,350 --> 00:43:34,430
thousands of simulated matches will go. The
winner is determined by simulations, not the

458
00:43:34,430 --> 00:43:40,370
speculation, but it's fun to imagine how a fight
could play out. Ajin and Kei, what are the rules of

459
00:43:40,370 --> 00:43:45,970
our speculation? Well, I should say there are no
rules, other than the teams have no prior

460
00:43:45,970 --> 00:43:50,890
knowledge of the other going into the fight. All
they are aware of starting out is that the other

461
00:43:50,890 --> 00:43:55,710
side is a threat that needs to be eliminated. For
the speculation, the groups will begin

462
00:43:55,710 --> 00:44:00,650
approximately 50 meters apart in a nondescript
environment that will have no bearing on the match

463
00:44:00,650 --> 00:44:06,150
itself, as no environmental statistics are
considered in my simulations. The teams must earn

464
00:44:06,150 --> 00:44:11,130
victory on their own merit. All right, then let's
get into it. The Legion of Superheroes and the new

465
00:44:11,130 --> 00:44:17,250
mutants meet on the battlefield. Who goes first?
I'm going to say that cannonball starts this off by

466
00:44:17,250 --> 00:44:23,570
blasting right into the air and then slamming down
right in the middle of where the Legionnaires are.

467
00:44:23,570 --> 00:44:29,510
And he slams right on top of Cosmic Boy actually and
scatters the rest of the team when he lands and

468
00:44:29,510 --> 00:44:34,970
creates this like massive shockwave. Not first
field, cannonball slams right into a force field

469
00:44:34,970 --> 00:44:39,890
generated by Brainiac 5 who could extend his
personal force field. He's just going to quickly

470
00:44:39,890 --> 00:44:44,470
envelop his team right from the get go when
cannonball shoots into the sky. You know,

471
00:44:44,470 --> 00:44:48,310
Brainiac is going to be doing all of these
instantaneous calculations determining his

472
00:44:48,310 --> 00:44:54,170
power and trajectory and stuff like that. So when
cannonball bounces off of the force field,

473
00:44:54,170 --> 00:45:00,310
Brainiac, he's going to collapse his force field
back to around him personally, and that's going to

474
00:45:00,310 --> 00:45:06,490
allow lightning glad to unleash this really
intense lightning bolt at magic that's going to

475
00:45:06,490 --> 00:45:11,910
then arc to every other member of the new mutants
electrocuting all of them. Now, because magic can

476
00:45:11,910 --> 00:45:16,870
just block the lightning bolt with her soul sword.
And that's when she teleports over to the

477
00:45:16,870 --> 00:45:21,750
Legionnaires in the middle of the group. And then
she does this magic spin slash kind of like link

478
00:45:21,750 --> 00:45:27,730
from the Legend of Zelda games. She's like, ah, and
all the Legionnaires get blasted away from her

479
00:45:27,730 --> 00:45:33,290
from this magic slash, they get blasted away.
Yeah, with magic energy. Okay. All right. So the

480
00:45:33,290 --> 00:45:38,870
Legionnaires, they all get blasted backward. But
bouncing boy, he just bounces right back like

481
00:45:38,870 --> 00:45:45,960
literally slamming right into magic, bouncing
off of her and then bouncing into Wolf's Spain. And

482
00:45:45,960 --> 00:45:51,250
the rest of the new mutants just like a pinball
knocking their asses over. Okay. All right. So

483
00:45:51,250 --> 00:45:57,890
bouncing boy bounces everyone, except magma, who
protects herself by erupting it like this geyser

484
00:45:57,890 --> 00:46:03,250
of lava from the ground right in front of her. And
bouncing boy crashes into the geyser and like

485
00:46:03,250 --> 00:46:07,810
lifts him into the air like a fountain. And he just
gets third degree burns all over his body and dies.

486
00:46:07,810 --> 00:46:15,950
Oh snap. Okay. Actually, Supergirl, she's going
to use her freeze breath to ice over that geyser

487
00:46:15,950 --> 00:46:23,310
pretty quickly. So while bouncing boy probably
looks like Freddy Krueger about now, his burns

488
00:46:23,310 --> 00:46:30,450
aren't fatal. And Supergirl, she's going to carry
him to safety while Saturn girl, meanwhile, she's

489
00:46:30,450 --> 00:46:37,410
going to take mental control of magma and cause her
to open a geyser beneath Sunspot. That's not going

490
00:46:37,410 --> 00:46:42,430
to do anything. Sunspot not only is he highly
durable, like pretty much almost invulnerable,

491
00:46:42,430 --> 00:46:47,750
especially to heat, but like all the heat
radiation from the magma would power him up

492
00:46:47,750 --> 00:46:53,230
actually. Like after a quick dip in this lava
shooting out of the ground, Sunspot's going to fly

493
00:46:53,230 --> 00:47:01,510
out and blast a solar blast at cosmic boy and just
fry cosmic boy like French fry. Except cosmic boy

494
00:47:01,510 --> 00:47:08,130
would block that blast by transforming these
metallic bobbles that he has on his outfit into a

495
00:47:08,130 --> 00:47:15,310
large flat metal shield, which he's then going to
push towards Sunspot and casing the metal around

496
00:47:15,310 --> 00:47:20,430
his head so you can't see or even breathe. That also
doesn't matter to Sunspot because he doesn't need

497
00:47:20,430 --> 00:47:26,130
oxygen when he's in his solar mode because he's
sustained by the photosynthesis. But if the

498
00:47:26,130 --> 00:47:31,550
metals covering his face, he will be blinded. So
while he's dealing with that, I'm going to say

499
00:47:31,550 --> 00:47:36,790
meanwhile, Wolf's Bane in full on beast mode, like
werewolf mode, she straight slashes off

500
00:47:36,790 --> 00:47:41,890
chameleon boy's antenna off of his head. So
quickly he doesn't have time to react. Well

501
00:47:41,890 --> 00:47:48,250
chameleon boy will just form new ones, you know? Ah
shit. And then he's going to transform into a eight

502
00:47:48,250 --> 00:47:54,430
foot Cthulhu type monster and his tentacles are
going to stretch around and bind Wolf's Bane while

503
00:47:54,430 --> 00:48:02,610
his claws pierce into her abdomen, killing her. So
she's out. No, because all of a sudden, he gets a

504
00:48:02,610 --> 00:48:08,610
neural arrow straight into his head area, which
stuns him. And that arrow came from Mirage who

505
00:48:08,610 --> 00:48:13,250
fired it because she's always been protective of
her friend Wolf's Bane. And chameleon boy

506
00:48:13,250 --> 00:48:20,810
stunned, which causes him to melt into a puddle.
Okay. And Wolf's Bane escapes. And then Cypher

507
00:48:20,810 --> 00:48:27,090
rides over on this like techno organic motorcycle
that Warlock transformed into. And he reaches

508
00:48:27,090 --> 00:48:33,130
down and transmutes the chameleon boy puddle into
like these techno organic nanites that he just

509
00:48:33,130 --> 00:48:40,530
absorbs into himself. Interesting. Okay. I'm
going to say before Cypher gets to chameleon boy

510
00:48:40,530 --> 00:48:46,350
though, lightning glad is going to intervene and
he's going to destroy Warlock's motorcycle with a

511
00:48:46,350 --> 00:48:51,190
lightning blast that's going to send nanite
pieces flying everywhere. And that's going to

512
00:48:51,190 --> 00:48:58,170
allow chameleon boy to slither away as a puddle and
recover. Meanwhile, Saturn girl, she's taken

513
00:48:58,170 --> 00:49:03,870
mental control of cannonball and she's going to
force him to plow straight into Wolf's Bane at full

514
00:49:03,870 --> 00:49:09,210
speed, just breaking her body completely. I don't
know how Wolf's Bane would actually get out of

515
00:49:09,210 --> 00:49:16,610
that. So she's probably out of the match, but magic
will create a portal to limbo that cannonball

516
00:49:16,610 --> 00:49:21,550
flies into and that will cut off Saturn girl's
telepathic hold over him. And then he's going to

517
00:49:21,550 --> 00:49:26,630
fly back into the match through another one of
magic's portals. And while that's happening, all

518
00:49:26,630 --> 00:49:32,270
of a sudden Wolf's Bane, who was thought dead on the
ground, rises up and now she's like a zombie

519
00:49:32,270 --> 00:49:38,810
werewolf. Okay. And she runs over to Saturn girl
and she's immune to Saturn girl's psychic probes.

520
00:49:38,810 --> 00:49:44,770
And she straight bites into Saturn girl's face and
just like chomps down on her, swallowing her whole

521
00:49:44,770 --> 00:49:51,670
and digesting her. I'm sorry. What the fuck is
going on here? It's an illusion that Saturn girl

522
00:49:51,670 --> 00:49:59,810
sees as a fear of hers, which is caused by Mirage, of
course. So Mirage gets Saturn girl to see Wolf's

523
00:49:59,810 --> 00:50:04,150
Bane rise up from the dead and eat her. So Saturn
girl's freaking the fuck out thinking she's being

524
00:50:04,150 --> 00:50:09,430
eaten. Of course she's not really, but as she's
freaking out Mirage stabs a neural spear into

525
00:50:09,430 --> 00:50:15,550
Saturn girl's back, which is going to paralyze her
mind and shut it down. So Saturn girl is now out of

526
00:50:15,550 --> 00:50:21,490
the match. No, dude, Saturn girl would not fall for
a mental illusion like that. She's an insanely

527
00:50:21,490 --> 00:50:27,490
powerful telepath. Actually she would because
Mirage's powers are empathic in nature, not

528
00:50:27,490 --> 00:50:33,410
telepathic. So it's like a sort of different
psychic attack. And it totally works on telepaths

529
00:50:33,410 --> 00:50:38,890
because it manipulates their emotions, not
necessarily their brain. Well, that's stupid.

530
00:50:38,890 --> 00:50:44,870
But whatever, sure, Saturn girl's out.
Meanwhile, Super girl, she is probably chasing

531
00:50:44,870 --> 00:50:51,310
down cannonball since she can match his speed. And
when she grabs him, she's going to steer both of

532
00:50:51,310 --> 00:50:57,810
them into the ground causing this deep impact
crater. And with cannonball pinned in the ground

533
00:50:57,810 --> 00:51:04,110
unable to move, he stops blasting. And that's when
Super girl sends a quick beam of heat vision right

534
00:51:04,110 --> 00:51:15,090
through his head, ending him and taking him out of
She's going to turn into her magma form and she's

535
00:51:15,090 --> 00:51:22,410
going to melt the metal off of Sunspot's face that
Cosmic Boy had put there. And Sunspot's then going

536
00:51:22,410 --> 00:51:27,990
to fly over to bouncing boy and just finish burning
him alive. Like whatever magma started, he just

537
00:51:27,990 --> 00:51:34,510
finishes and then Sunspot kicks him like a charred
soccer ball. And he kicks him so hard that like

538
00:51:34,510 --> 00:51:39,470
bouncing boy bounces to the other side of whatever
country they're in. That's fucked up. Yeah, I

539
00:51:39,470 --> 00:51:43,230
guess that wasn't necessary, but I tried to get a
soccer element in there with bouncing boy because

540
00:51:43,230 --> 00:51:48,930
Sunspot's really good at soccer. Anyway, Cypher
at this point has transformed himself into a

541
00:51:48,930 --> 00:51:54,950
Nanite cloud using Warlock's power. And he swarms
over to chameleon boy and like he avoids his whole

542
00:51:54,950 --> 00:52:00,250
motion sensor and tannethink by translating
their movement and determining their function.

543
00:52:00,250 --> 00:52:05,670
So like he stealthily gets around chameleon boy
and then reforms and stabs chameleon boy with an

544
00:52:05,670 --> 00:52:11,010
arm sword, which infects chameleon boy with a
techno organic virus and converts him into

545
00:52:11,010 --> 00:52:17,990
technology. So chameleon boy is now a techno
organic being under Cypher's control. And he

546
00:52:17,990 --> 00:52:23,970
commands chameleon boy to take the form of a
missile that Cypher then loads into his new arm

547
00:52:23,970 --> 00:52:30,230
cannon and fires at lightning lad, just
obliterating both chameleon boy and lightning

548
00:52:30,230 --> 00:52:39,090
lad for a twofer explosion. Now, except Cosmic Boy
saw chameleon boy being infected by the tiny metal

549
00:52:39,090 --> 00:52:46,430
Nanites and Cosmic Boy he's generating this EMP
blast that's going to shut down all of Cypher's

550
00:52:46,430 --> 00:52:53,110
Nanites, which just dropped to the floor like
sand. So chameleon boy is gone, but so is Cypher and

551
00:52:53,110 --> 00:52:59,430
lightning lad, meanwhile he has Mirage in his grip
and he's overloading her with electricity until

552
00:52:59,430 --> 00:53:07,670
she's fried. So she's out. Okay, Mirage is out, but
Magma shoots a lava wave at lightning lad that

553
00:53:07,670 --> 00:53:14,530
hardens into stone on contact. So she encases
lightning lad in obsidian and he's trapped inside

554
00:53:14,530 --> 00:53:20,650
the stone and he just suffocates to death. Okay,
well guess what? You're done messed up because

555
00:53:20,650 --> 00:53:26,910
lightning lad was Cosmic Boy's friend. So now
Cosmic Boy, he's going to pull down a meteor from

556
00:53:26,910 --> 00:53:33,990
space like the size of a fridge and it's going to
slam right down on Magma, sending her Magma form

557
00:53:33,990 --> 00:53:40,310
just splattering everywhere. Yeah, that would
work if Magma couldn't control rock. She's just

558
00:53:40,310 --> 00:53:45,730
gonna break this meteor apart before it even
touches her. No, you said she controls like earth

559
00:53:45,730 --> 00:53:55,050
rock, not space rock. Like this meteor is like an
alien Xenomineral. Okay. All right. You may have

560
00:53:55,050 --> 00:54:00,130
got me there. Okay, so Magma's out then. She gets
crushed by this meteor, right? But then all of a

561
00:54:00,130 --> 00:54:06,810
sudden, magic drops from a portal above Cosmic
Boy. She lands on him and she stunts him with her

562
00:54:06,810 --> 00:54:14,410
soul sword and then she snaps his neck with her
Eldritch armor arm. Oh, you mean her metal arm? No,

563
00:54:14,410 --> 00:54:20,170
no, no, it's Eldritch armors, magic. It's not
metal. Like some artists may render it metal, but

564
00:54:20,170 --> 00:54:25,550
like sometimes they also render it just black,
like black demon armor. Like her soul sword is made

565
00:54:25,550 --> 00:54:30,910
out of her soul, even though some artists draw like
metal and some make her sword look more like a

566
00:54:30,910 --> 00:54:36,370
lightsaber, right? But either way, none of its
metal, even if it looked like it and Cosmic Boy

567
00:54:36,370 --> 00:54:41,330
tried to manipulate it, he wouldn't be able to.
It's magic and he'll still be out of this match.

568
00:54:41,330 --> 00:54:48,850
Well, that's dumb. So I have Supergirl and I have
Brainiac Five left and you have magic and Sunspot.

569
00:54:48,850 --> 00:54:57,030
So with so few people left, I'm gonna say Sunspot
blasts Supergirl with solar energy, like what? An

570
00:54:57,030 --> 00:55:02,630
idiot? And her Kryptonian cells are just gonna
absorb the attack. And when Sunspot is like, oh,

571
00:55:02,630 --> 00:55:09,890
that's when Supergirl is gonna snatch him, drain
him of the rest of his solar energy and just hurl his

572
00:55:09,890 --> 00:55:16,910
ass right up into outer space powerless. Oh, damn.
Would he do that? What else is he gonna do? Sure, I

573
00:55:16,910 --> 00:55:21,970
guess he wouldn't know that Supergirl absorbs
solar energy. That's on him, I guess. So now I just

574
00:55:21,970 --> 00:55:27,070
have magic left and you have Brainiac and
Supergirl. So magic's gonna take this fight to

575
00:55:27,070 --> 00:55:32,570
limbo, okay? Because there she's the sorceress
supreme. She's the ruler. So she creates

576
00:55:32,570 --> 00:55:39,430
teleportation portals and just sends everyone to
limbo. And while there, this big King Ghidorah

577
00:55:39,430 --> 00:55:45,290
Hydra looking demon just burns Supergirl alive
with Hellfire. And I don't care how powered up

578
00:55:45,290 --> 00:55:50,910
Supergirl is, she's vulnerable to magic like the
rest of the super family. So Supergirl's out. And

579
00:55:50,910 --> 00:55:56,850
now it's just magic and Brainiac. And magic
telekinetically pulls off Brainiac's

580
00:55:56,850 --> 00:56:02,530
Legionnaire flight ring so that he can't fly. And
then she sets up two portals suspended in midair

581
00:56:02,530 --> 00:56:08,750
that cause Brainiac 5 to just fall forever for all
eternity in a portal loop in limbo. And that is how

582
00:56:08,750 --> 00:56:14,830
the new mutants win this match. Okay, that was a
good move. But I'm gonna say while Brainiac is

583
00:56:14,830 --> 00:56:21,670
falling in this portal loop, he's going to unleash
a Nanite grenade that he built from repurposed

584
00:56:21,670 --> 00:56:28,970
warlock Nanites. And when these Nanites explode,
they infect the demons in limbo, converting them

585
00:56:28,970 --> 00:56:36,690
into tech under Brainiac's control. So Brainiac
causes limbo's demons to turn on magic and devour

586
00:56:36,690 --> 00:56:43,350
her, ending that endless portal loop. So the
Legion ends up winning actually. How did Brainiac

587
00:56:43,350 --> 00:56:49,170
repurpose these warlock Nanites if they were
rendered inert by cosmic boys EMP? Oh, he just

588
00:56:49,170 --> 00:56:55,390
rebooted them and re-energized them using his own
tech. I don't know what a techno organic infested

589
00:56:55,390 --> 00:57:03,110
demon would look like, but I think magic would be
able to purge the virus using her magic. Cause

590
00:57:03,110 --> 00:57:10,710
magic trumps tech. Now you would think that, but
you would be wrong because tech in fact trumps

591
00:57:10,710 --> 00:57:19,350
magic. And I think Iron Man would agree with me.
Well, I think Dr. Strange would agree with me.

592
00:57:19,350 --> 00:57:25,630
Well, let's go ahead and leave the match there.
Either magic beats tech and she's able to purge the

593
00:57:25,630 --> 00:57:32,870
demons of the techno organic virus and defeat
Brainiac, or tech beats magic and the infected

594
00:57:32,870 --> 00:57:38,230
demons eat magic. That is correct. But either way,
I don't know how Brainiac 5 is getting out of this

595
00:57:38,230 --> 00:57:43,830
infinite portal loop. Well, once magic is dead, it
just ceases to exist. And you know, he'll find his

596
00:57:43,830 --> 00:57:48,010
way out of limbo eventually, or he'll just
freaking take over the whole dimension. Alright,

597
00:57:48,010 --> 00:57:51,890
well, let's go ahead and leave the match there.
We'll enter the stats and see what end scenario

598
00:57:51,890 --> 00:57:59,110
happens when we run the simulations. AG9K, hit it.
Inputting data, running calculations,

599
00:57:59,110 --> 00:58:05,810
processing results, simulations complete. This
was a fun match. Both teams are awesome. And

600
00:58:05,810 --> 00:58:11,710
they're pretty similar in that Legionnaires are
kind of like mutants in a way, and that a lot of them

601
00:58:11,710 --> 00:58:17,770
really only have one power. I mean, except for
Supergirl, but for the others, that was

602
00:58:17,770 --> 00:58:22,290
definitely reflected in the stats. Yeah,
Supergirl was the most powerful member out of

603
00:58:22,290 --> 00:58:27,350
either team. But just barely more than magic.
Yeah, the weakest member out of either team was

604
00:58:27,350 --> 00:58:31,650
Wolfsbane, which sucks, because I really like the
character of Reince and Claire. But

605
00:58:31,650 --> 00:58:37,430
statistically, she wasn't all that great. You
know, she's fast and can fuck you up with her claws

606
00:58:37,430 --> 00:58:43,850
and fangs. But the fact that, you know, she goes
into her wool form, that she's not very versatile

607
00:58:43,850 --> 00:58:50,390
or anything like that, she just didn't hold up.
Your weakest guy, though, was Bouncing Boy. Yeah,

608
00:58:50,390 --> 00:58:57,510
not surprising. Definitely did not hold his own
against Cannonball. His counterpart, as it were,

609
00:58:57,510 --> 00:59:02,130
he basically got obliterated by him in the stats.
You know what sucks, though, is that all of the

610
00:59:02,130 --> 00:59:07,870
Legionnaires have their flight ring, which
grants them like interstellar flight speed. So

611
00:59:07,870 --> 00:59:13,730
the Legionnaires just wiped the floor with new
mutants when it came to the speed stat. That was the

612
00:59:13,730 --> 00:59:18,170
greatest disparity between the two teams, was
that the Legionnaires were much faster overall

613
00:59:18,170 --> 00:59:22,910
because of their rings. Yeah, and the biggest
advantage that the new mutants had was that they

614
00:59:22,910 --> 00:59:28,570
were much more durable. Some of my guys have force
fields and stuff like that, but without those,

615
00:59:28,570 --> 00:59:32,850
they just didn't have the physicality that your
guys did. Yeah, I mean, like Supergirl's

616
00:59:32,850 --> 00:59:38,830
invulnerable, but so is Cannonball when he's
blasting, Sunspots highly durable, and so is

617
00:59:38,830 --> 00:59:44,450
Cipher when he's merged with Warlock. Most of the
new mutants team did pretty well. Like Magic won

618
00:59:44,450 --> 00:59:50,010
about three fourths of all of her matches against
the Legionnaires, Cannonball won about half, and

619
00:59:50,010 --> 00:59:55,530
then you have Wolfsbane who only won 14% of her
matches in total. Supergirl was definitely my

620
00:59:55,530 --> 01:00:01,090
highest winner, also winning about three fourths
of her matches. My next most successful character

621
01:00:01,090 --> 01:00:07,790
was actually Cosmic Boy, and no surprise,
Bouncing Boy lost a majority of his matches. So

622
01:00:07,790 --> 01:00:13,230
Jonathan, who do you think is winning this one, and
why is it the new mutants? Uh, why is it not the new

623
01:00:13,230 --> 01:00:20,350
mutants? Because I'm voting for the Legion 100%,
and I'm not the only one who did. According to our

624
01:00:20,350 --> 01:00:27,230
Instagram poll, 67% of those who voted voted in
favor of the Legion, even though the new mutants

625
01:00:27,230 --> 01:00:32,790
had a movie. That's terrible. What does that make a
difference? I'm just saying popularity wise, you

626
01:00:32,790 --> 01:00:37,230
think people would have gone for the new mutants,
but people are smart. You know, they know how

627
01:00:37,230 --> 01:00:43,970
powerful the Legion is. Well, let's see if they're
right. AJ9K, the results please. All right, the

628
01:00:43,970 --> 01:00:54,310
winner in the team duel matchup between the Legion
of Superheroes and the new mutants is... the

629
01:00:54,310 --> 01:00:59,290
Legion of Superheroes. I'm sorry, what was that?
Legion of Superheroes one. I can't understand

630
01:00:59,290 --> 01:01:05,030
you. One more time. I said the punk ass Legion of
Superheroes. Who are they? Out of the thousands of

631
01:01:05,030 --> 01:01:11,790
simulated matches between the two teams, the
Legion of Superheroes won 51.7% of the time,

632
01:01:11,790 --> 01:01:19,470
whereas the new mutants only won 48.3% of the time.
That is close. I thought the Legion was going to

633
01:01:19,470 --> 01:01:25,170
stop much more than that. Like I figured the Legion
was going to win this because the Legion is just

634
01:01:25,170 --> 01:01:30,670
powerful. I'm legitimately surprised how much of
a good fight the new mutants put up. I'm not. I

635
01:01:30,670 --> 01:01:34,690
thought they were going to win because you're
dumb. But the fact that they barely lost is

636
01:01:34,690 --> 01:01:39,010
something to be proud of. I think I would have
preferred that they won. You know, if the

637
01:01:39,010 --> 01:01:43,210
Legionnaires didn't have their flight rings, I
think the new mutants would have actually taken

638
01:01:43,210 --> 01:01:49,910
this. Well, too bad for you. They do. So better luck
next time. I'm not going to need luck for our next

639
01:01:49,910 --> 01:01:59,030
matchup. I got skills. You got Skittles and that's
it. I also have Skittles. What of it? Well, that

640
01:01:59,030 --> 01:02:26,770
does it for this duel. AJ9K helped close us out.
Forget to listen to the other shows in the Dynamite

641
01:02:26,770 --> 01:02:33,830
podcast network, including Max Destruction,
Senjo World, and Console Combat. In our next

642
01:02:33,830 --> 01:02:39,750
matchup, where Joseph thinks he will need no luck,
but will in fact need all the luck in the world, we

643
01:02:39,750 --> 01:02:46,030
will pit Bizarro versus Abomination, the evil
counterparts to Superman and the Hulk

644
01:02:46,030 --> 01:02:50,170
respectively. That'll be a good one. I'm really
looking forward to that one. But that does it for

645
01:02:50,170 --> 01:02:54,930
this episode. We want to give a big thanks to our
executive producers, John Staroski, Zachary

646
01:02:54,930 --> 01:02:58,810
Hepburn, Destin Belcom, Mickey Mataengian,
Nathaniel Wagner, Levi Yatyn, Austin

647
01:02:58,810 --> 01:03:04,530
Wieselowski, AJ Dunkerley, Nick Ibonto, Scott
Camacho, Gil Camacho, Adam Spies, Dean Maleski,

648
01:03:04,530 --> 01:03:09,630
Devin Davis, Joseph Kirsting, Josh Leiner, Mike
Williams, and Paul Graves for helping make this

649
01:03:09,630 --> 01:03:22,850
podcast possible. We'll talk to you guys next
week. Up up and away, true believers. Shrinking

650
01:03:22,850 --> 01:03:23,850
Heroin Small Lass