Zack Snyder's Justice League Review

[Music] hi and welcome to the dynamic duel podcast a weekly show where we review superhero films and debate the superiority between marvel and dc by comparing their characters in stat based battle simulations i’m johnny dc and i’m his twin brother marvelous joe and we finally made it after a year plus of waiting for the snyder cut it has finally arrived we are reviewing it this episode there is a lot to talk about the film is four plus hours long hopefully this review will not be as long no way no way we would be up until like eight in the morning of the next day that being said we also do break up our episode in chapters so you can skip ahead throughout the episode if you want to jump to a specific topic because before we get into the review we’re going to go over the comic book movie news from the past week including the news that an hour man film is in development and the news that venom let there be carnage has been moved to september 17th we want to give a huge shout out to a new patron of ours ryan boutian i think that’s how you pronounce it if not please ryan reach out to us let us know and thank you so much for supporting the show yeah anyone who’s listening don’t forget that this podcast now has a card game out called dynamic duel war that you can find out how to get by joining us on patreon if you want to have fun simulating battles between marvel and dc characters check us out on patreon.com dynamic duel and just a quick reminder guys to please subscribe to our show if you haven’t already and if you have please help us grow our podcast audience by leaving a quick rating or review on whatever platform you’re listening to us on we want to give a shout out to two reviewers uh who raided us on apple podcasts one elmo 900 and it looks like they just smashed their keyboard uh thank you guys so much for your reviews and uh for interacting with our show but with that out of the way quick to the no prize and no prize is an award marvel used to give out up until the 90s to fans our version the dynamic duel no prize is a digital award we post on social media that jonathan personally draws for those who we feel gave the best answer to our question of the week last week’s question tied into the news that billy crudup would not be returning against henry allen in the upcoming flash movie so we asked which actor has left a role in a marvel or dc film or show that you really wish had stayed we got so many great answers for this it was hard narrowing it down to just three honorable mentions and the no prize winner but let’s go through those our first honorable mention goes to max from the ready to retro podcast who has been a guest on the show and we reviewed the spider-man film definitely check that episode out and check out his podcast ready to retro that’s the numeral 2 but his answer was this is max from ready to retro my answer to this week’s question is hugo weaving who played the red skull in the first captain america movie although it’s getting better of late marvel has been criticized for having less than dynamic villains along with weaving’s award-winning acting and the deep history of the red school i feel like weaving’s departure really hindered for some great story lines not just with cap but with the mcu as a whole yeah the red skull is one of those like classic arch nemesis for an iconic hero like captain america it would have been great to see those characters meet again like in modern day and just continue to go at it yeah the red skull definitely has the potential to be more than just a one and done villain we were fortunate again to see him in infinity war and end game but it wasn’t hugo weaving that was in the role it was ross marcont doing basically a hugo weaving compression a really good one a really good one but uh when you have an actor that’s the caliber of hugo weaving you just want to see him back our next honorable mention goes to john spies of the blast from our past podcast who was also a guest on this show also has a great podcast check out the blast from our past and check out the episodes where they guested on this show reviewing x-men origins wolverine and batman the movie from the 1960s his answer was hey boys this is john over at blast from our past for me this is an easy one hugh jackman as wolverine i don’t care how old he gets i think he can come back as many times as you want especially now with everything going into the mcu so i’ll hold tight maybe it’ll happen we’ll see in general seeing hugh jackman leave the role of wolverine was hard to deal with i’m really glad that he got the send-off that he did in the logan movie but it would have been great to see him interact with the other cast of characters from the mcu especially with robert downey jr that also sucks because he’s not in that role anymore so it’s just wishful thinking for something that likely will never happen i mean you never know they’re also bringing back like michael keaton in dc they’re bringing back alfred molina and jamie foxx and marvel yeah that’s true i guess if they ever wanted to go the multiverse route you could always have hugh jackman come back as old man logan from a separate universe than the logan movie yeah as long as they don’t pull evan peters on us yeah and call him boner yes old boner logan god our final honorable mention goes to harrison fox who said hey guys harrison fox here so the actor who i wished had stayed on is val kilmer as batman now don’t get me wrong i will always take michael keaton as the superior 90s era batman but when kilmer left we got george clooney and his bat nipples and that is just unacceptable now i have to agree as much as i preferred michael keaton as batman i also prefer val kilmer vastly to george clooney yeah we recently reviewed the batman and robin film and expressed our thoughts about george clooney there we thought he was a decent bruce wayne but a horrible [ __ ] batman that being said he was not the first 90s batman to have the bat nips that was vel kilmer in his second suit within the batman forever movie yeah what was it like the sonar suit i think yeah yep but bell killers bat nipples were just like dots as opposed to george clooney’s which had like the areola and just hearing that word i’m like uh great answer harrison before we name our no prize winner we want to give a quick shout out to everyone who reached out to us and left us an answer on our website including zachary hepburn nate john strauroski jacob bell and shane habezin yeah thank you guys so much for taking the time out of your day to reach out to us we love hearing your messages but the winner for this week’s no prize goes to al gustafsson who said hey guys alego stefson from denmark so in terms of question of the week i’m going to go with chadwick boseman i guess a lot of guys are gonna name him but still i’d love to see him in the black panther fulfilling his role i love his calm attitude and the way he speaks so yeah we’re not gonna see any more from that guy unfortunately but uh yeah stay safe and this answer hits a little bit different from the others because with the other roles the actors left and with chadwick boseman and black panther he unfortunately passed away and uh he is absolutely the actor i would most want to see come back into the role because it would mean that we got him back we know that black panther 2 is not going to be featuring him in that role and that they’re going to go a different route telling the story of like maybe shuri’s black panther or something like that but if and when they do recast it’s just not going to be the same it won’t ever be the same he defined the role just as much as christopher reeve did or heath ledger and both of those actors also passed away i like al’s description of chadwick boseman’s performance where it was really subdued you know chadwick boseman was a chill guy which is this unbeatable cool we’ll always remember so fantastic answer and just to know no two people who submitted an answer gave the same response yeah we also got patrick stewart ryan reynolds ben affleck and the director edgar wright though those last two kind of didn’t count because but affleck is returning as batman and edgar wright was a director but yeah congrats again to al gustafson for winning this week’s no prize if you the listener want a shot at winning your own no prize stay tuned to later on this episode when we’ll be asking another question of the week and now that that’s done on to the news okay so in a surprise bit of news it was announced on march 17th that an hour man film was in the works with writers gavin james and neil whitener now those two don’t really have any writing credits to their names it seems like all of the projects they’re working on are upcoming projects such as san andreas 2 and now you see me  okay so that doesn’t bode well i don’t think it kind of doesn’t but i feel like warner brothers and dc have been sort of trying to push a hour man film for quite some time i remember back when i think even before the flash tv show came out they were hinting at an hour man television series for warner brothers that never happened but we did get to see iron man in the star girls series and that was pretty cool yeah out of all the jsa characters they could have chose i’m kind of surprised that they went with our man it really seems like dc is pushing the jsa in general perhaps to get more dc team content out there not related to justice league yeah i didn’t even think about that this may be a way to push justice society because we know our man is also going to be a member of the upcoming animated film justice society world war ii now we know that other gsa characters like hawkman cyclone atom smasher they’re all being introduced in the black atom movie and i’m wondering if that movie is going to take place within the same universe as this hour man film it would be kind of cool if dc was sort of taking the marvel route with the building of the justice society team and that like characters would get individuel films before they all kind of built up to this greater team film it didn’t quite work out that way with justice league but luckily warner brothers and dc have another property to do that yeah and that way you don’t get a four-hour film where you have to go through new character introductions i mean that also is really amazing is it though it is it is yes now do you think this film is going to focus on rex tyler or rick tyler or even the android hour man i think the great thing about an arrow man film is you could kind of focus on all three because of the time travel aspect of the character they could all sort of exist in the same movie as it were do you think in addition to the time travel aspect of the character they’ll also touch on the addiction aspect if they didn’t i think they would be missing out on a pretty integral component of the character he does take a drug called miracle to get his superpowers and it is addictive the character of rick tyler has at times been severely addicted to the drug it’s just a really interesting and unique aspect of the character i think yeah and i think it would send a positive message given that eventually he is able to overcome his addiction if you guys want to learn more about our man go ahead and listen to our hour man vs bishop episode yeah i actually really liked that matchup in other news uh we learned this past week that the film venom let there be carnage that’s been pushed back to september  what is it eleven nine might as well be eleven kind of scared sony causing it to push it back yeah that was kind of a uh power move by universal studios moving the fast and furious film to the same date as the venom sequel you know you can’t compete with faster than the furious it’s just a huge franchise it’s gonna make all the money that weekend and venom had to make the hard decision to move back to the fall which is probably a better spot for it considering that more theaters will be open at that time that being said it’s becoming such a crowded year for films given that you know not a lot of them released last year venom is still gonna struggle going up against these other films that are coming out that day including death on the nile boss baby sequel oh jeez [ __ ] that’s gonna make bank but as not ideal as that date is it’s more ideal than this previous summer day when not only would it be going up against a different competition but again not as many theaters would be open i think the closer you put it to halloween the better probably yeah it’s not a bad season there’s been a lot of films with success in the fall like joker that’s true i do have to say though if i had a choice between seeing venom and gal gadot who’s in death in the nile i’m gonna choose gal gadot stop thinking with your dick i’m not it looks like a good movie oh yeah can i do it who else is in it [ __ ] um kenneth branagh okay you pass yay right your wife will let you off the hook this time [Laughter] but you know in regards to the whole topic of movie theaters reopening and when people are comfortable getting back into theater seats that brings us to our question of the week when is the earliest you can see yourself going back to theaters to watch films whether that’s immediately or a year from now or however you feel let us know we’re interested in hearing your answer yeah super interested i’m trying to figure out when i’m going to go back record your answer at dynamicduel.com by clicking on the red microphone button in the bottom right hand corner which will prompt you to leave us a voicemail your message can be up to 30 seconds long and don’t forget to leave your name in case we include you on the podcast we’ll pick our favorite answer and draw that person a dynamic duel no prize that we’ll post to social media be sure to answer before march 27th but that does it for all the news for this episode so let’s go ahead and get into our main event where we reviewed the long-awaited hbo max film zack snyder’s justice league all right so zack snyder’s justice league was finally revealed to the public via hbo max this past week after years and years of fans demanding it from warner brothers if you’re not aware of the legend of the snyder cut of the film let me prologue this review with a somewhat brief recap after the success of christopher nolan’s batman films warner brothers wanted to capitalize on their success by rebooting superman with a similar tone nolan helped select zack snyder as the director to undertake that project which proved to be controversial when audiences and critics complained that the film was too serious in tone costing the man of steel and its sequel batman v superman also directed by zack snyder hundreds of millions of dollars at the box office by the time batman v superman was finished warner brothers had lost faith that zack snyder could deliver them the sweet sweet box office cash that the marvel cinematic universe was generating and they stepped in to make the film more consumer friendly though i would argue also less comprehensive as anyone can see by comparing the theatrical version of batman vs superman to zack snyder’s ultimate edition that was released on video later on yeah we have reviews for both of those films i believe we gave batman v superman’s theatrical cut three and a half stars and we gave the ultimate edition four stars yeah that’s right it was a drastically different film much like how zack snyder’s justice league is drastically different from the theatrical cut exactly now despite warner brothers lack of faith in snyder they let him make justice league though it wasn’t long before they began meddling during production even hiring a new writer joss whedon to rewrite some of the film now joss whedon directed the first two avengers films for marvel each of which had grossed over one billion dollars at the box office hell yeah so warner brothers felt that they had a sure thing rather than fight back against the studio zack snyder whose daughter autumn had recently tragically committed suicide left the film to spend time healing with his family over their loss joss whedon took over the film as its new director and the film still ended up a critical and commercial failure not everyone myself included hated man of steel and batman v superman however and those fans insisted that there must be a superior cut of the justice league film made by zack snyder somewhere in the studio vaults after years of campaigning buying sky banners and billboards asking warner brothers to release the snyder cut it was finally announced last year that it would be released on warner brothers new streaming platform hbo max in 2021 and here we are this whole thing is rather unprecedented it’s almost disruptive to the traditional studio director relationship and it really goes to show that you know if you give the fans what they want they will pay for it yeah that’s ultimately the best business decision you can make as a studio it’s to give the fans what they want although studios especially warner brothers not gonna lie are still learning that i don’t get it now the biggest question that anyone had about the snyder cut other than whether it existed was whether or not it would be better than the joss whedon version the answer is yes it’s a much better film yeah every fan of zack snyder who helped get the snider cut released should feel very vindicated and all the haters can die in hell that’s [ __ ] up well it’s hard to say that this is the snyder cut take it down [Laughter] that would have originally been released in theaters and had gone on to win billions of dollars in critical acclaim okay it does come across as an uncompromised version of the film you know being presented in a four three aspect ratio and clocking in at over four hours in length there’s a lot of story here a lot to talk about i seriously doubt anyone who waited years for the snyder cut would have waited to watch it until they heard whether we recommended it but just in case here’s your spoiler warning that being said if you have not seen the film and you’re trying to gauge whether or not you will like the film the answer lies with whether or not you appreciated zack snyder’s vision before if you absolutely despised man of steel and batman v superman this movie is not going to do anything for you but if you liked man of steel and batman vs superman this movie is going to be fantastic for you yeah odds are you’re gonna love this one i did and i loved bvs the ultimate edition and man of steel both also in terms of spoilers i think part of the fun of watching this cut is finding out what was originally shot by zack snyder and what wasn’t so don’t ruin that for yourself if you haven’t seen the film there was a surprising amount that was different in this cut and i kind of knew that going into it but it was still a surprise to me now like the ultimate edition of batman v superman this film ultimately proved that warner brothers was wrong to meddle in a project that had such a visionary director at the helm now people may scoff at zack snyder’s films but they can’t deny he has a vision you know people complain that it’s too dark for dc but as a comic book reader and dc comics fan i respect zack snyder for taking these characters and stories so seriously i mean some of my favorite comics that i’ve read the dark knight returns kingdom come sandman watchmen they didn’t go out of their way to make me laugh they were trying to tell these larger than life stories in this universe that allows you to do that i think the general public continues to think of comic book stories and characters as something non-literary as something not serious or worthwhile enough to consider high art but zack snyder does zack snyder strives for high art but he doesn’t succeed for the most part there are some things that i think that he does that are quite breathtaking but it is kind of a sophomoric approach to high art because he’s also throwing in a lot of pop elements well he’s a music video director you know it’s a music video director aiming for high art that definitely shows because i feel like every 10 minutes in this movie there was a music video going on i mean people can feel differently about how artistic snyder is and how he represents dc’s characters but it should be evident by this point that he recognizes the epic and with the logical nature of the dc universe as a whole absolutely and i think that’s the primary way he distinguishes dc heroes from marvel heroes and that’s just true in general but he’s the one that really hammers at home in that marvel superheroes are relatable grounded pop culture characters whereas dc characters he views as more modern mythology and there’s a difference between the two yeah he explicitly described you know marvel films as heartfelt action comedies and dc can do that but why not go deeper than that like why make a batman forever when you could make the dark knight you know dc has always prided itself on originality so i would never want them to copy something someone else is doing especially marvel and zack snyder doesn’t want that either i mean that’s what joss whedon did with his cut of justice league he tried to make it a marvel film and he brought his marvel sensibilities to it and that’s what the studio was really asking for and that’s ultimately what made it such a failure in part yeah i understand warner brothers wanting to make mcu level money but that’s not going to happen without someone like kevin feige producing a cinematic universe and so far for the time being zack snyder has been the closest thing to that for the studio having produced or executive produced all of the dc eu films except for shazam and bird’s prey i believe and joker of course but that wasn’t dc eu right i like this film a lot i think this is my favorite dc film ever i think it’s definitely the most important not only is it about the justice league but it culminates a trilogy of a visionary director like zack snyder in this massive superhero epic it’s exciting it’s gorgeous it’s an emotional saga and it fulfilled everything i would have wanted from a justice league film compared to the previous version that left me wanting so you would say that you were extremely satisfied with the end result that you got oh yeah absolutely but do you still wish it could have been edited down because that’s my main wish i you know i’m entirely satisfied with what we got i would say that it’s great but it’s also not necessarily great because of what it also includes which is a little bit too much yeah you and i watched the film together and have kind of gone back and forth over whether the pacing of the film was good i didn’t think this film was poorly paced because i didn’t watch it from the viewpoint that it was a theatrical film or experience i didn’t feel it was overly long in the same way i didn’t feel something like wanda vision or hbo’s watchmen was overly long i don’t mind binging hours of television episodes and this film was so episodic it felt like i was simply just binging this epic long-form justice league story for the most part i wouldn’t have trimmed anything about the film that being said okay so you’ve chose to view this movie as a series now we all know that it was originally intended to be a series and that was changed at the 11th hour yeah six part series is what the film was edited to be yeah and it shows the way they break it down in chapters i think if i had watched this a chapter at a time a week at a time i wouldn’t have had any problems with the pacing but the fact that we chose to sit down and view all of this in one four hour sitting made it more difficult i would not recommend that actually anybody watch it that way i would recommend that people watch it as much as they can stand for as long as it takes their ass to go numb and then come back and then view the rest because it’s just too much parts of it feel like the last  the return of the king lord of the rings movie i mean you could go ahead and bemoan like about what you feel should have been cut from the film but in the end i care more about the integrity of zack snyder’s vision than your attention span no no but this movie could have been cut down and likely would have been cut down if it was released as a single film in theaters and zack snyder has said as much he said that you know there is a two hour and twenty minute cut of this film yeah he also said there’s a three hour cut and a three and a half hour cut and a five hour cut oh god and a six six-hour cut no but what he gave us is what he chose to give us it was his favorite version of the film for an episodic release yes exactly i still want to see his version that would have been released in theaters i don’t mind the length when i watch other film epics like ben hur or the extended editions of lord of the rings i go into it knowing i’m going to spend a lot of time with these characters and i personally loved again every moment i could get with the justice league because i may not get more of that for a while fair enough fair enough i wouldn’t say that this movie was paced like a ben hur or lord of the rings because those didn’t feel episodic but you got to know what you’re going into when you’re going into it yeah absolutely that’s true i do think that part of the success of this film more than any other hinges on how closely it adhered to zek’s vision like the film itself the behind the scenes story is one of sacrifice and redemption they go hand in hand hence the title of this movie you know zack snyder’s justice league my take on zack snyder’s justice league is that it’s still not necessarily the best version of this film there were ironically some parts of joss whedon’s justice league that i actually enjoyed better some elements from that movie sacrilege [ __ ] off i actually really enjoyed joss whedon’s dialogue more than zack snyder’s thought there were some lines from joss whedon’s film that would have done better in this movie like what well there are a ton of examples but one is like when cyborg is like what part of this looks like a gift but joss whedon is a little bit more clever where he’s like if this is a gift why am i paying for it you know just little things like that that were scattered throughout the whole movie i’m willing to sacrifice that line and other lines like about brunch in order to have the epicness of the zack snyder’s version to me that’s a small sacrifice little bits of clever dialogue i don’t need it i also do like some of the character arcs from joss whedon’s movie such as lois lanes i like how in jos whedon’s cut lois lane went back to work because that’s the thing that she knows best that’s very in keeping with the character of lois lane as a daily planet reporter in this movie she literally did nothing but mope around and yeah i understand she’s sad but i feel like the way that lois would handle grief would be through her work she’s a pulitzer prize-winning journalist she could write about her grief just let her dwell in it and sit in it and then write an article about it yeah but she doesn’t write about her grief but in just whedon’s justice league she did and she gave a great ending kind of speech narration at the end of that film and i think that was sorely missed as well lois’s whole arc i would have rather kept from joss whedon’s version even the part where she’s thirsty [ __ ] no oh you can’t have one without the other yeah well then i’ll take that i feel like that’s a small sacrifice to make for the better servicing of the character well in terms of lois lane he’s letting her stew in her grief a little bit longer with her arc being hey lois maybe you should get back to the real world before she does it still feels out of character for who i know lois lane to be you don’t [ __ ] know lois lane i know okay [Laughter] she was always this independent spirit do you think she would cope more like joss whedon portrayed her or more like zack snyder lois lane has always been someone who got into [ __ ] because she wouldn’t stop being ambitious regardless of whether she would no in the comics you know i wouldn’t say she necessarily went back to work but she definitely investigated like superman’s missing body and then wrote an article about project cat yes that said i would have much rather have the film establish the new characters in the flash in aquaman and cyborg than revisit lois lane it was fine what they did with her with just her grieving you know what’s funny though is that they could use the time showing her sit on her ass showing her doing something more interesting it would have taken the exact same amount of time and it would have been sure to character just admit that what would she have been researching that would have only been interesting if we knew what she was writing about she was writing about a world without superman in that movie amy adams lois lane has already had plenty of character development over the course of two films prior she did have something to do in this movie though you could have set that up better instead of showing her walk for 40 minutes from a coffee shop in slow motion all she had to do in this film was just be there for superman she really didn’t have anything to do in this film and even that they did wrong because i also preferred how lois was batman’s backup plan whereas this movie she just happened to be there luckily she saved batman’s life because batman didn’t have a [ __ ] backup plan in this movie batman didn’t know that super owner was gonna come back confused and yet he would have prepared for it regardless because that’s what batman does he prepares for all eventualities it’s okay for there to be some things that were better in the theatrical cut than this version this version was not supremely superior you know it was mostly better you’re a [ __ ] joss whedon sympathizer no i’m not guy’s a [ __ ] dress we didn’t sympathize [ __ ] this guy no way not me no not this guy that’s basically what you’re saying right now no no i don’t condone any just sweden stuff except his writing okay yeah his sexist writing about being thirsty and [ __ ] what and falling on wonder woman’s boobs no that’s what you like okay nice deflection just do that rather than own up to the possibility that yeah there may have been some things done better in the other version that’s not to discount all the stuff that this movie did better here’s the thing in the same way that the theatrical version of batman v superman is dead to me so is the joss whedon version i don’t even want to pretend that it even exists okay it’s dead to me i don’t care if some parts were better or not ultimately the preferred version and the version that i love is this one [Laughter] you’re getting a little emotional about this whatever dude i’m not crying you’re crying let’s get into the character breakdown starting with batman now batman kind of took a backseat to bruce wayne in this version of the film that wasn’t necessarily a bad thing though because i really like zack snyder’s bruce wayne ben affleck is still in my opinion the most comics accurate version of batman despite you know the killing from bvs he does some killing in this film too but they’re parademons they mentioned in the film that when the three mother boxes join together and form the unity the planet is terraformed into a planet like apocalypse and all the survivors are transformed into parademons now this is the one conflicting bit of information i found from snyder’s original plans for this film originally the parademons were going to be like vampires capable of turning others into parademons just like them we saw this transformation take place very briefly in the original film when this man in the ancient war against uxos was transforming while screaming into the sky as he was becoming a parademon my theory is that the whole parademon vampirism angle was cut by snyder after he heard the criticism of batman’s killing people would have complained again if he was straight up killing parademon humans instead of trying to change them back so he just left the parademons as aliens right exactly now there are a lot of parallels i find between the themes within the film and the behind the scenes story of the film bruce’s arc was all about faith about following his gut as opposed to rationality to build a team and resurrect superman this was a natural progression of his arc from bvs in which he didn’t have faith that someone as powerful as superman could be good and beneficial for mankind batman should have had faith in superman just as warner brothers should have had faith in zack snyder yeah man of steel and bbs weren’t the most successful of films but rather than giving in to rationality by hiring a quote unquote sure thing in joss whedon to take over they should have left him alone to complete his vision ultimately batman and warner brothers gained faith and resurrected the things they shouldn’t have killed that’s a nice parallel that whole angle for batman did feel slightly out of character but in a good way because it was refreshing to see batman take an approach that he’s never really taken before so i i liked that expansion upon his role in this movie other than that there didn’t seem to be too many differences he was still really cool loved all the gadgets that he had in this i really liked the gauntlets that he was given by alfred yeah that was a great addition he was less jokey in this version of the film yeah thank god i mean that’s that’s in keeping with the character it is kind of weird that we didn’t see batman even show up in this film until halfway through it at the two hour mark that was a little bit disappointing i think they should have had one scene early on with him kind of like they did in the just reading but oh geez i will concede one thing i actually really did like that early batman scene in the joss whedon cut of him like going around like the water tower and stuff against that criminal yeah i’m glad they ditched the smelling fear aspect and the whole exploding parademon turning into three boxes yeah yeah i mean that didn’t even make sense because we had no idea how batman even knew about parademons never explained that but then again the film doesn’t exist so what the [ __ ] am i talking about [Laughter] you’re just talking crazy man i am really glad that ben affleck will be returning to the role one more time in the upcoming flash movie it’ll be good to see him get a send-off and holy crap if this film does well i really hope they make that deathstroke versus batman movie that would be amazing oh yes that would be epic how the [ __ ] are they not going to make that movie that movie needs to be made come on that actually kind of pisses me off it does doesn’t it yeah hashtag release the deathstroke batman film moving on to wonder woman uh i’ve said it before and i’ll say it forever gal gadot is the perfect wonder woman and i love the warrior version of her we got to see here after wonder woman 1984. yes she was so [ __ ] hardcore brutal in this film but also so graceful it was it was just perfection the great thing about wonder woman that i think we missed from 1984 is yeah there’s two sides to where there’s the warrior side and the peacekeeper’s side you know but when you have the warrior side you still have that dichotomy because she is such a peaceful character when she’s not tearing you to shreds like she’s not like a gritty character you know and i think that’s what people think the warrior version is it doesn’t have to be at all yeah i really liked how she was kind of an archaeologist explorer in this movie more yeah i loved the tomb raiding scene with her like it gave her a little bit more to do and made her like the de facto historian of the group like like a tomb raider indiana jones type of angle i think that’s a brilliant way to handle the character i would love to see an entire movie of her like exploring greek mythological stuff and then like fighting greek monsters of myth yeah like medusa or something like that yes that would have been such a better sequel than 1984. like wonder woman just travels the world putting together clues along with barbara and minerva in order to locate the hidden location of the mascara why that’s right because barbara and minerva was an archaeologist yeah oh god they dropped the [ __ ] ball plus her whole arc really is tied into that of her mother hippolyta right i mean actually you could say most of the leagues members arcs were tied to their parents in some way and after steppenwolf decimated the amazons hippolyta called out to her daughter for the first time with the arrow of artemis and she cared for the safety of her daughter in man’s world and wanted her to come back to her diana gains a new connection to her parents both of them while researching the amazon’s past and by the end of the film she’s gazing off into the sunset as if she’s going to try to find them again and reconnect with more of her roots so if they would have done that for the sequel that would have totally made sense yeah this film not coming out actually hurts the wonder roman sequel i feel like petty jenkins would have gone the 1984 route anyway though because she’s such a fan of the tv show yeah yeah i also loved the music you know just when you thought the wonder woman score couldn’t get any better you just add some like lamentful chanting and boom it adds a whole new dimension to it that totally works i gotta disagree with you on that one they used way too many lamenting chants every time she showed up on screen like it was it just become unnecessary at some point i thought it worked really well i actually really liked tom hulkenberg’s score throughout the film i thought it was a lot better than what danny elfman did which is surprising because danny elfman is really good this score was definitely much more mythical and epic it suited the material better yeah moving on to the flash ezra miller played the flash and his performance was one i was probably the most apprehensive about going into it they just made him so awkward in the theatrical version and he wasn’t any less awkward here but the added scene of him saving iris set up the character a bit better and made him a bit more endearing having saved a woman having played with dogs you know it makes him much more likable than just him scribbling on some guy’s face i liked that scene though it was great i think once you had like the whole iris west saving scene you probably didn’t need more setup than that now the flash’s displays of power in this cut were some of the coolest things i’ve ever seen on screen we’ve talked to before about the challenges of displaying powers that we’ve already seen before in movies typically when it comes to super speed filmmakers either go the smallville route with like just a blur or the quicksilver in x-men days of future past route with like slow motion bullet time yeah and we mentioned last time that it was cool how they portrayed the flash’s powers as pretty much just teleportation with a lightning trail right they sort of did a mix of everything in this film but they also did some really interesting new things like when the flash was literally flashing everywhere to save the scientists from the falling debris or like the whole backwards time travel running at the end with the world reforming around him as he ran yeah that was cool so beyond amazing the scope of this film and of what these characters can do is unbelievable now the flash’s arc was about taking control of his life or as his father told him to forget living in the past and make his own future he’s a static character in that he didn’t quite learn his lesson you know by the end of the film he’s still trying to get his father out of jail but that’s okay because he pushed himself beyond his limits and learned that he can quite literally live in the past to quite literally make his own future i’m really looking forward to the flash film now more than ever do you still feel like there’s an aspect to this version of the character that is kind of barry allen in name only compared to how he acts in the comics yes uh absolutely that said people are always harping on zack snyder for his films being no fun with no humor i actually thought the flash brought a great balance here you know there were some scenes in the joss whedon version where he was cracking jokes where in this version he was a little bit more serious yeah this movie definitely was not as humorous as joss whedon’s version but it is definitely more humorous than anything else zack snyder has done yeah exactly i think christario the writer took criticisms you know from his bbs script and adjusted accordingly moving on to cyborg now ray fisher’s performance was amazing in this film it was actually much better than i thought it would be zack snyder has said before that cyborg was the heart of this film but i didn’t quite get what that meant at the time but i have to say there were multiple moments during cyborg storyline that got me choked up when rey was in the car talking with his mom when dr silas was standing over his son’s broken body in the hospital crying and promising he wouldn’t let him die even the scene with the waitress woman that he helped all of that was really powerful stuff yeah and ray fisher is just a great actor when you watch him act it doesn’t even seem like he’s acting it seems like he’s just embodying the role it’s really kind of too bad that he kind of torpedoed his own career yeah to bring in walter hamada someone who had nothing to do with the justice league film to me was kind of unnecessary but it is what it is now we’ll see how this film helps or doesn’t help his career going forward i personally think he did a fantastic job in this role and i would love to see him get more work he has a lot of potential as an actor in terms of talent i just wish he employed a little bit more tact off camera because i think he could have gotten exactly what he wanted if he would have played his cards a little bit differently absolutely cyborg’s arc in this film was all about accepting his father’s decisions to not see him play football to turn him into a quote-unquote monster to sacrifice himself to help his son save the earth early in the film cyborg is pretty hostile towards his father you know crushing the tape recorder his father gave him just as dr silas was talking about being his father but by the film’s epilogue cyborg had come to peace with himself and his father and finished the recording learning that his father truly loved and cared for him and we got to see that in the film like silas may not have gone to see his son play football but you could see the wonder on his face to watch his son walk alongside the other justice league members well silas knew that his son was like a techno god he told him as much in the tape recording so i’m a little bit surprised that he was so surprised maybe it was just the realization of that that took him aback but uh or just the admiration of it yeah it was nice to see his reaction there were some parts in the script that didn’t quite gel with me like when cyborg said [ __ ] the world despite the fact that he had just literally got done helping someone in the world by giving that lady some money that he was watching yeah i mean he’s a complicated conflicted multi-layered character you know he may have wanted to help that one person but she may not have represented the world who he felt he really didn’t owe anything it felt less layered and more inconsistent i could see that i thought the display of cyborg’s powers were a lot better in this cut of the film like the jets that shot out everywhere from his body the extra arms watching inside his head how he symbolically viewed the digital world it was all really cool stuff aquaman was also really cool but he’s played by jason momoa so no surprise there his character sort of had the least amount of improvement in this cut in my opinion but it was still an improvement like not as good as what james juan did with the character in his solo film but this justice league cut did a lot more to set that film up like add the character of volkow i forgot that he was even supposed to be in this movie i think the thing that i enjoyed most about aquaman was how badass he was in a fight oh yeah the last version yeah his trident in this film yeah like made him a bit more like on par with other members of the justice league he also seemed wiser and less brash in this cut i don’t know if it was just from his conversations with diana or barry or him being like the only member of the team this time to say hey maybe resurrecting superman may not be such a good idea but he seemed like a stronger leader i really liked his interactions with the flash they were kind of far and few between but those two characters are diametrically opposite yeah they’re foils they could not be more different and yet they interact so well like i want to see an aquaman and flash team up movie that would be great like in the theatrical cut aquaman’s arc was still about being less of a loner and accepting more of his atlantean heritage and legacy in order to help save the world and they kind of showed that he was like worshiped or revered as some kind of like savior character by the icelandic town yeah they like wrote songs about him and like kept his sweaters and sniffed them it was like kind of awkward that song went on for way too long it was kind of weird starting out so early in the film i was kind of like hmm what is this exactly but luckily like they got the awkward part out of the way the rest of it was great do you feel like that was a little indulgent i think it was there for a purpose for a reason to show how they deified these justice league characters and they are godlike you know that’s sort of again what sets dc apart from marvel a lot of people describe the avengers as heroes trying to be gods and the justice league as god’s trying to be human so playing up on the whole mythological aspect i understand why it was included moving on to superman all i have to say is thank god this cut did not have henry cavill’s creepy cgi mouth that alone is worth the ticket price with the hbo max price now superman actually appeared less in this film than i thought he would partly because they cut the super awkward opening scene with him talking to those kids but also because the film is twice as long he doesn’t make an appearance until chapter 5 it doesn’t suit up until the final chapter i kind of wish they would have explained the black suit a little bit more in the comics the black suit is also known as the solar suit and it was used to absorb more solar radiation after he died so he could recover faster yeah i’m concerned some people will think that zach chose to put him in the black suit for this movie just to maintain his dark edginess and i mean they never really explained that that isn’t the case he definitely comes across as a little bit darker in some way in this film yeah it was a little bit weird when he freaking burned off steppenwolf’s horn like a [ __ ] sadist all his bloods pouring out of his head i was like damn bro take it easy do you think that was too violent for superman i think it was hinting at something darker going on with his resurrection and that certainly wouldn’t have set well with superman purists who have never enjoyed zack snyder’s take on the character because it was really just zack snyder doubling down on the darker side of the character yeah absolutely and i think that was intentional honestly i think the route that zach has said he’s wanted to go with this storyline it would have led to a dark superman like injustice but i want light superman you’d have gotten that at the very very end of zack snyder’s justice league trilogy too long superman really didn’t have a problem of like being too weak upon his resurrection in this film though i really think he should have like i would have much rather seen him and the league members react to him resurrecting as you know weak unable to help rather than have him have like temporary amnesia like in both cuts of the film i thought superman was just portrayed as too powerful in this movie when he shows up there are no more real stakes because he’s just so capable and i had that criticism for the last cut too it’s no fun to watch you know you see superman totally not get phased at all by steppenwolf’s axe and i think that it should have because steppenwolf is a new god i don’t care how powerful superman is you can’t just do that i mean you could argue that him putting on the black suit and going up to the sun like supercharged him so that he was like super superman i’m gonna go with that it’s weird that superman was able to no sell the axe attack to the shoulder and yet darkseid got his ass handed to him by ares with an axe to the shoulder i feel like that was done on purpose to show that really dark side is a [ __ ] and superman is just an overpowered character well i mean when darkseid took the axe to the shoulder from aries that wasn’t dark side at the time that was ook sauce that was like pre-dark side dark side before he got the omega force and you could tell because his eyes weren’t glowing and where did they explain this in the movie i’m just gonna say that was dark side and that thanos could be dark side because all you have to do is just take an axe to dark side shoulder and it’ll puss out thanos wouldn’t have pussed out pretty sure thanos did take an axe to the shoulder and guess what right after he killed half the universe darkseid gets an axe to the chest and then he was like bye again it was ook sauce it was a dark side okay i’m just gonna have to take your word for that i guess okay speaking of steppenwolf just to jump to him really quick other than cyborg he had the most improvement from the theatrical cut not only did he look a hell of a lot cooler you know replacing the scrotum cap with [ __ ] knives everywhere but his backstory had more of a hook he was a disgraced exile of apocalypse trying to get back in the good graces of darkseid in order to return home yeah they definitely explained his motivations better in this movie and and you kind of sympathize with him and they may be due to the character model that they chose yeah he had a very uh sympathetic facial expressions absolutely yeah i mean he was the clear-cut bad guy of the film but you’re right they also made him more sympathetic through his backstory through his big eyes seeing darkseid crush his skull at the end just made you kind of hate darkseid a little bit more yeah yeah for sure and maybe wonder went a little bit too for chopping his [ __ ] head off and will aquaman for impaling him too yeah for superman for [ __ ] disfiguring him god damn the justice league was brutal they don’t [ __ ] around okay okay i mean thor chopped off thanos’s head yeah but he was you know not in the right headspace this is justice league on a good day yes exactly you don’t mess around with them imagine what the justice league would have done to thanos oh [ __ ] yeah they would have [ __ ] castrated him yeah through his chin because that’s like where his balls are yeah right yeah exactly [Laughter] it really did help showing how much steppenwolf feared and revered darkseid in this cut as well like it’s clear in this film that steppenwolf isn’t the main threat so the stakes are a bit higher yeah steppenwolf is a stepping stone and like wonder woman they also made him way more lethal and imposing in this cut just seeing him charge all the time and just like not being phased by anything anyone was doing to him until the justice league got involved it was it was really great i was impressed by his armor specifically in the scene when he was shot up full of arrows by the amazons yeah and you just shrugged it off literally yeah yeah i also love that they didn’t make him like a weird creepo who was like telling queen hippolyta that like she was going to learn to love him or something like that that was weird that’s just just whedon projecting exactly moving on to the plot breakdown the film starts off with a prologue of superman’s death roar echoing around the world and awakening the mother boxes it was kind of cool to have that callback to bvs in the same way that bvs had a callback to man of steel yeah when it opened yeah the movies kind of bled into each other yeah exactly now the film as we mentioned earlier is broken up into six different parts and an epilogue first part or first chapter is called don’t count on it batman it starts off with bruce wayne traveling to a poor icelandic village and trying to convince aquaman to join his cause to which he is unsuccessful in london wonder woman saves a group of hostages from a terrorist group’s bomb and that was a much better scene than in the joss whedon versus yeah i like the extended version i love the portrayal of her powers especially in regards to the use of her silver bracelets to block the bullets from this automatic gunfire it looked so damn cool yeah yeah absolutely what’s interesting though is that this scene actually has no point to the rest of the film it was just a way to sort of reintroduce wonder woman and her powers yeah at the end of this first chapter in themyscira where wonder woman is from steppenwolf arrives and takes the amazon’s mother box as we just mentioned a little bit ago the scene was so much more badass and emotional than the theatrical cut like seeing all of those amazons sacrifice themselves packed so much more of an emotional punch this time and seeing steppenwolf and the parademons just explode out of the water when that temple fell into the ocean i was like oh [ __ ] this guy’s like a movie monster he just keeps coming for you now part two was called the age of heroes steppenwolf sets up his base in an abandoned nuclear plant in a deserted russian town and sends his parademons out to find the mother boxes apparently they can smell their scent back at themyscira queen hippolyta fires the arrow of artemis toward the shrine of the amazons and that arrow is pretty cool it’s even cooler that you get to see like the context and history of that arrow later on oh yeah in the battle scene yeah yeah they’re like missiles exactly and diana sees the warning and discovers details about the ancient war against darkseid now where was the secret area of the amazonian temple located because i didn’t see the opening well they had like a lot of excavation tools like around the shrine and there were like workbenches and stuff like that so i’m sure that the whole area was under some kind of archaeological study okay not that big of a stretch underwater volco asks aquaman to help protect the atlantean motherbox now anytime any of the atlantean characters spoke underwater they created these air bubbles yeah which kind of really annoyed me it was very not in keeping with james wan’s aquaman film especially when later on when miro was giving orders to the atlanteans and you couldn’t quite make out what she was saying and it sounded very underwatery and there were also points where she was like pointing and like squeaking like a dolphin really yeah did you see that i don’t get what the big deal about talking underwater is i think they should have just gone with that like an aquaman movie yeah it turned out to be not a deal at all also like how did volko make the water bubble like he doesn’t have water manipulation powers like mara so i don’t know that’s true after that steppenwolf calls it assad and we learn that he’s an exile of apocalypse diana visits bruce and tells him of the invasion and the history of the mother boxes and she does it in this like really cool flashback showing the ancient war between all the tribes of earth and like a green lantern against dark side and his forces we got to see a lot more of jalen garr the green lantern yeah along with the greek gods like aries like zeus like artemis all badass i thought it was cool how zealous ares was in the battle and how he was the one that delivered that devastating blow yeah yeah that was cool now darkseid revealed the omega symbol that was carved into the earth the same one that the mother boxes revealed to steppenwolf later in the film to let him know the anti-life equation was on the planet what i’m wondering is how did darkseid forget that the anti-life equation was on earth diana tries to explain it like in the throwaway line about how earth became an anonymous planet among trillions to the new gods but still like earth was apparently the only world dark side had ever lost you’d think he would remember where that was yeah he got beat there the anti-life equation is there the mother boxes were left there how do you forget that [ __ ] he just passed out and everyone else was like let’s all agree to just never talk about this ever again it’s kind of a big plot hole it is i think yeah part three was called beloved mother beloved son it’s in this part where we’re introduced to barry allen who saves iris west from a car accident and visits his father in prison he goes home to find bruce wayne who recruits him for his team that’s still a great scene i love that scene the bruce wayne scene yeah yeah i do enjoy that did you get weird vibes when iris west was like floating in the air like about to die with a total serene look on her face and barry allen goes up to rescue her and instead of immediately rescuing her brushes the hair on her head aside a little bit and gaze is logging at her and then immediately reaches for a hot dog like i got like real creepo vibes from that i mean i’m not gonna lie i did have immediate questions about the hot dog but uh i mean he put it in his pocket right away so it was fine and as for the hair thing do you want somebody brushing the hair on your head without you knowing they’re made for each other it’s it’s barry and iris well thank god because otherwise yeah yeah way to ruin a beautiful moment for me sorry do they ever explain barry ellen’s origin in this film are they saving that for his solo film uh that is something that i noticed they don’t explain it they absolutely will have to touch on it in the solo film yeah because he got access to the speed force while getting struck by a bolt of lightning while working in the crime lab but he doesn’t get the crime lab job until the end of this movie so i’m wondering how that happened i’m sure we’ll figure it out later yeah yeah like the lightning bolt traveled back in time or something like that yeah also in this chapter victor reaches out to diana through the bat computer and asks her to meet him they meet but cyborg refuses her recruiting effort i wonder why cyborg reached out to diana if he knew that he was going to reject the offer i think he wanted to reject the offer in person i think he knew that they were looking into him and he just maybe wanted to know why in person victor’s father silas stone gets kidnapped by parademons after which bruce and barry meet diana back in gotham meanwhile in atlantis steppenwolf gets their mother box after fighting aquaman and mera that was a great scene i really like the action beats in this movie the fight between aquaman and steppenwolf was over so quickly in the joss whedon cut it was ridiculous and this at least the atlanteans put up a fight yes absolutely especially that part with mira like pulling out steppenwolf’s blood that was messed up damn it did a good job of showing how much of a threat she was the chapter ends when cyborg returns home to find his father missing and the bat signal in the sky now earlier in this chapter cyborg sort of explores his power there was a scene where he helps out that waitresswoman yeah i was on twitter just kind of looking at everyone’s reactions the day that the snyder cut came out and the woman who played the struggling mother waitress i saw her on twitter she was like i don’t have hbo max my role was cut from joss whedon’s version did i make the snyder cut and everyone was like yeah you were in it and your scene was so great that was really cool to see that is really cool well hopefully she can get hbo max and see it yeah part 4 of the film was called change machine in it cyborg batman wonder woman and the flash talk with commissioner gordon and visit the parademon’s nest to rescue the hostages they fight steppenwolf for the first time and steppenwolf floods the tunnel and aquaman arrives allowing the other heroes to escape another great action set piece a lot of great moments specifically with the flash and that moment where he’s saving the people from the debris falling i thought that was really cool i thought all of them had great moments in this scene you know wonder woman was a total badass going up against steppenwolf it looked so much better this time batman had his gauntlets and the nightcrawler going for him cyborg was there with his extra arms and you know flipping over the nightcrawler and stuff like that the flash saved all those people like you mentioned and aquaman came in at the very end to save everyone from drowning it was a great team effort yeah the force field the aquaman created to stop the flow of water made more sense given that it appeared his mom’s trident did have some kind of like magic force projecting powers yeah yeah totally when it like slammed against something in this case he slammed the base against the ground yeah i like seeing him surf that wave too that was cool like why cut that yeah so great why cut so much from this scene specifically for the theatrical cut it was all great stuff i don’t care if it’s you know 10 minutes longer it’s fantastic steppenwolf returns to his base and receives a vision from the mother boxes that the anti-life equation is on earth he contacts assad and darkseid orders steppenwolf to unite the boxes and destroy the planet at which point he will come to earth to claim his prize this is kind of like a big moment for steppenwolf because before desado was like piss off steppenwolf yeah maybe when you come back with 50 000 more worlds then we’ll talk yeah it was strange though that darkseid said that he had conquered a hundred thousand worlds and then assad said that steppenwolf had to conquer fifty thousand worlds so this seems like a lot compared to darkseid oh yeah totally decide to not like steppenwolf no you know he was talking [ __ ] about him the whole time yeah over on apocalypse poor steppenwolf exactly like especially at the end when when dassad was like [ __ ] told you steppenwolf wouldn’t be able to cut it darkstarter was like dude i know the new gods are so [ __ ] the league members meet and realize that they can use cyborg’s mother box to resurrect superman martha meets with lois to discuss their grief over losing superman and martha turns out to be martian manhunter which really did not make sense explain this to me i don’t know why marsha manhunter would have been so interested in lois lane he figured she was important in some regard i think because he’s really been spying on every single dc superhero thus far this would have made it seem like because he knew that bruce wayne was batman and stuff like that and of course you know he’s a telepath so maybe that’s how it worked but the fact that he was such in character as martha kent even using like her midwestern slang and everything like that it was just so bizarre it did seem kind of uh reckless and the fact that you know lois lane could be like hey martha remember that last time we talked and martha would have been like i haven’t seen you in forever yeah they really shouldn’t have made him marsha manhunter like they could have kept the end scene at the very end yeah and not had this right here it would have made the scene between martha and lois lane actually mean something yeah yeah exactly yeah it would have been more heartfelt instead of just like a ruse in part 5 which was called all the king’s horses the league digs up superman’s coffin and cyborg hacks the star lab security system to get access to the kryptonian ship the kryptonian ship warns against resurrecting superman showing a vision to cyborg of the nightmare future where the unity is activated and lois lane dies and superman succumbs to darkseid’s anti-life becoming his pawn this was interesting because so far all of the nightmare sequences had only been seen by batman which makes you wonder was the kryptonian ship sending those visions to batman all along or how is he getting those and why is cyborg all of a sudden getting them and does the kryptonian ship have the ability to tell the future it definitely made it seem that way especially when it was like the future has now taken root in the present yeah i thought that was strange i really wonder if they really had plans to expand where this all was coming from in future movies they had to have yeah maybe they would have gotten like booster gold involved with the kryptonian chipper i i have no idea but they could have it was cool to see kilowog in that nightmare vision yeah you watched that part several times i remember thinking it was really cool how the modern green lantern suits were depicted in the dc eu yeah it wasn’t like the ryan reynolds version it was more just like a green shiny metallic kind of look yeah as opposed to ryan reynolds which was like this uh second skin energy skin kind of yeah yeah exactly in the kryptonian ship the flash charges the mother box and it resurrects superman a battle ensues between a confused superman and the others but lois lane returns and snaps superman out of his aggression and they fly off together i do miss the pet cemetery line but i enjoy the fighting more in this version i’m also really glad that like the slow motion reveal that superman can follow and track the flash was zack snyder’s idea yeah it was just hilarious it was one of my favorite moments from the theatrical version it’s also great here yeah steppenwolf arrives and silas sacrifices himself to mark the mother box before steppenwolf gets it and boom tubes away and the league regroups at the bat cave to track the motherbox’s heat signature it was so tragic seeing silas die yeah especially when it wasn’t quite clear as to what he was doing or why he had just done that i thought he was trying to destroy the box apparently so did cyborg initially until he saw the literal writing on the wall that explained what silas was actually doing yeah it ended up pretty clever yeah yeah it was in part six which is called something darker the league finds steppenwolf stronghold and formulates a plan for cyborg to fuse with the mother boxes to separate them from being united the league travels to steppenwolf space where the unity process has begun meanwhile superman dons a black kryptonian suit and flies to help the team this is the scene that i think everybody wanted to see it was so much better done the way all the characters took out the pair of demons and their roles to play within this master plan at the end it was fun to watch it was so fun to watch and again each of them had their own specific roles that really helped out i love how batman was like you know the first one to go in and not only did he take out the shield but he took out a [ __ ] ton of pair of demons and he was just so badass in the batmobile doing that what did you think of that group shot it was kind of reminiscent of the age of ultron shot of the avengers all flying by the camera in the same shot yeah but i think actually it was done better here i just know i want a poster of it [Laughter] that would be awesome it is a really fun scene seeing wonder woman and aquaman team up to fight steppenwolf that was really well done yeah and seeing batman like take out all the pair of demons while everyone else is in on the inside fighting steppenwolf yeah the flash like running around the city like trying to build up energy that was super sad when he got shot how the hell did he get shot it was just a lucky shot i mean he was like literally there like almost every instant so it was about to happen so yeah the flash gets shot by a parademon as the boxes merge and the league sees darkseid through a boom two portal from apocalypse the mother boxes synchronize and the earth is destroyed but the flash like goes intangible as that wave of destruction passes over him which was really cool he then runs so fast he runs into the past managing to hit cyborg with a charge before the boxes sink that was amazing that’s probably my favorite scene of the whole movie the music was really well done there i think too and i think ezra miller sold it for sure yeah i like his lines talking about i like how he wishes his dad could see him because he actually is among the best of the best yeah for sure yeah absolutely the scene proves it now cyborg and superman together managed to separate the boxes i did think it was really cool how once cyborg was in the boxes the three boxes themselves revealed themselves as him and his two parents like joined together and like don’t you want them to be one don’t you want them to be united yeah it was manipulative and the boxes themselves kind of manifested as these three witches like the three fates or something as they were being pulled apart again yeah that was really interesting especially considering that they’re called mother boxes you know yeah seems like that’s where they get their name from from those apocalyptic and witches exactly really cool interesting angle to that and i love cyborg’s line about i’m not broken things are fine right now that’s when he sort of like makes peace with who and what he is yeah the moment of catharsis with that self-acceptance the league kills steppenwolf and the portal to apocalypse closes and the league returns home in the epilogue which is called a father twice over cyborg mourns his father listening to the rest of that tape that he had given him how did he put the tape recorder back together that’s what i was wondering i almost would have rather have had his body absorb like just the tape and like it transform into a tape recorder on its own rather than like telekinetically put back together the broken recorder that didn’t make sense to me yeah and i think that would work even better if it was a digital recorder as opposed to an analog recorder but you know we see aquaman decide to visit his father which would have set up the aquaman film and we see ryan choi being promoted to the head of the star labs research unit studying the kryptonian ship and that was cool if you’re not familiar with ryan choi he’s the atom and you can learn more about him in our atom vs ant-man episode yeah he is a protege of the silver age adam ray palmer and it looked like they were setting him up for the justice league sequel which would have been really cool yes yeah bruce and diana visit the rundown wayne manor and discuss turning it into a headquarters for their team now batman ran pretty loose with his secret identity in this film yeah i imagine if they would have established a headquarters in wayne manor everyone would have [ __ ] known that he was batman it’s no wonder lex luthor knew it by the end of this film yeah well he would have had to have kept the headquarters a secret i assume or just say that he’s financially backing the team there you go yeah that could have worked lex luthor escapes remarkable asylum and meets deathstroke revealing batman’s secret identity as bruce wayne and again i really want to see that movie that would be a dope movie joe manganiello does have a great deathstroke voice i think yeah for sure in another dream sequence slash vision of the nightmare world batman cyborg mara flash deathstroke and the joker meet and talk before an anti-life controlled superman finds them and bruce wakes up from his dream in the present let’s talk about this joker scene [ __ ] awesome it was really cool and i know it was included because zack snyder wanted to give a slight taste of what the future of the justice league story would have been and it makes me really sad that we might not get that most likely won’t get it yeah it was a really kind of powerful scene the joker was just really [ __ ] with batman continually referencing the death of dick grayson yeah i thought it was a great line when he said why would you send the boy wonder to do a man’s job batman should have just been the [ __ ] out of him right there yeah i wanted to the reach around line was a little weird that was an ad-lib from jared leto that doesn’t surprise me and i guess jared leto i guess like once that scene was done he looked over to zach and i was like that line’s not going to make it in and zack snyder was like are you sure about that i do really enjoy seeing jared leto back in the role though i think he did a much better job here than he did in the suicide squad film and that was evident from the trailers but there’s just something about his eyes specifically like they’re always really round and wide and glossy he could just hold his stare without blinking for so long it is really creepy yeah and that smile that smile he gives when he says that batman is just joking with him yeah yeah that was a great joker smile it’s like his smile just kept growing and growing and growing it was creepy as hell it looked like uh the creepypasta character i can’t remember his name and actually the cinematography when he was holding out the truce card where the card was in focus and the joker was blurry there was something about that that was super creepy too just seeing him in the background kind of like moving weirdly yeah moving weirdly with his weird smile it kind of reminded me of like the movie it where you could see like pennywise in the background yeah yeah the line the joker delivered about how bruce was too much of a coward to just die i guess in zack snyder’s future plans a pregnant lois lane dies which is what causes superman to succumb to anti-life but batman could have saved lois lane and he keeps going back in time trying to save her it just doesn’t work until ultimately he realizes that the only way to save her was to sacrifice himself so the line about how batman was letting multiverses die because he wouldn’t die really foreshadowed what was to come i really kind of wish they would have ended the film with superman opening up his shirt and i actually wish that would have been the blue suit in that shot too but they should have ended the film there put on the nightmare scene as a mid-credits scene and then the martian manhunter shot at the very end of the credits i think that would have helped the pacing of this whole thing flow a little bit better i agree because the shot from the superman symbol to the nightmare sequence was too hard of a cut yeah i think yeah in setting in tone and everything it was just like what what is going on yeah if you did have them as mid-credit and end credit epilogue scenes that i think would have been easier to digest yeah now as for the martian manhunter scene at the end i would have done that a lot differently i would have had general swanwick come and start talking with batman and then bruce wayne like realizes during the course of the conversation that he’s a telepath and forces martian manhunter to like reveal himself that would have been cool as opposed to you know just the whole blase kind of cavalier attitude that bruce wayne showed toward martian manhunter that was weird yeah like thanks for showing up so long he almost found it like funny he was like oh here’s another alien knows who i am it’s like dude you should be concerned about that the potential implications are huge especially considering like he doesn’t know about mars like there could be an invasion from mars coming or something like that you know that was weird it should have been done much much differently i think yeah at the very end of the film it ends with a dedication that reads for autumn and zack snyder has gone on record during interviews saying that autumn was really one of his few children that actually was interested in the superhero stuff he was working on he has like six children wow yeah but i think autumn was his oldest i could be wrong and i really do believe that and note on the screen that says for autumn i really do think that he didn’t make this for anyone other than his daughter you know we know that he made it for no pay and really not even necessarily a favor to fans but again i think as a sort of a cathartic way to wrap up that time of his life where his daughter tragically died that’s sad yeah and just based off of interviews and stuff like that with critics from the new york times and washington post and things like that i truly think that zack snyder is done with the dc universe as much as i would hope that he would continue with it i think at this point he just really doesn’t care and is looking to move on to other things maybe that’ll change down the road yeah but we’ll see there’s been a lot of talk about his plans for what would have happened in justice league two and three and i really hope we get to see those one day but uh i don’t have the highest of hopes at this moment yeah well and even if this is his last work dc has shown that they’re perfectly capable of moving on without him um he’s set up a good foundation here but you look at movies like wonder woman and aquaman and shazam they could take what he’s done and work with it yeah i mean it’s not gonna be as much of a high art approach again as what he’s trying to do which is what i really appreciate but you’re right and that it may not necessarily be bad because i loved shazam i loved aquaman yeah i loved wonder woman and not everybody appreciates zack snyder’s approach they can still do the same content without his excess i guess when it comes to visionaries like him i’m not as concerned with mass appeal as i am just telling a really good story and i personally feel like he does that i do hope he found some peace with completing and releasing this and i hope one day you know he’s at a point where he feels like he could revisit it because we would all love it there’s a lot to appreciate here not only is it a vast improvement over the theatrical cut but its existence is a credit to the fandom those of you who helped get this made truly are a justice league because you all got justice for this cut of the film for zack snyder that’s a good way of thinking of it it’s also a huge milestone as we mentioned earlier in terms of the industry it’s disruptive will lengthy stories such as this be the new norm if the movie going market chooses the home viewing experience over the movie theater experience oh that’s fascinating yeah we’ll see well typically a movie’s run time will be around two hours because of movie theater scheduling right if you don’t have to worry about that yeah then you can have a movie as long as you want it to be as long as the story dictates so you’ll start seeing more things like the irishman and things like that that’s pretty fascinating it is it’s going to be really interesting to see how streaming affects storytelling going forward when you can watch things at your own pace anything’s possible now i think in part because of the impact it’s going to have on the industry and the genre and because the movie was just so freaking good i’m giving it a half star bump up from the theatrical version and giving it four stars yeah i think four stars is good i mean i have no doubt that the people who clamored for this movie got exactly what they wanted that being said there are a few issues inherent within the approach and the story itself that don’t make it a perfect film it is highly enjoyable it is so much fun to watch at parts it is also a little bit hard to sit through if you do try to make it through one sitting i really do wish that they would have found a way to work out a deal with the actors and the other talent so that this could have been episodic because i think that would have helped the experience yeah i agree maybe one day we’ll get another snider cut i doubt it actually well we are getting the justice’s gray version in a few weeks right and then i’ll have a little bit more footage with like the joker and stuff like that so who knows you know this this might still all happen we’re not gonna review that oh we totally are no then we’re going to have three justice league rubies oh god one man of steel review two bbs reviews and three justice league reviews it just makes sense oh my god but i think four stars is definitely what i would give this yeah and i would say that this is probably my favorite zack snyder film um i would say i enjoyed it just as much as man of steel which we also gave four stars yeah and i really liked that movie yeah along with bbs the ultimate edition but that does it for this review let us know what you thought about zack snyder’s justice league by writing to us at dynamicduelpodcast gmail.com or by visiting us on facebook instagram or twitter you can find links to all of our accounts by visiting our website dynamicduel.com and on our site you can also find a link to our patreon page where we offer bonus content and our very own marvel vs dc card game called dynamic duel war so check it out right after this episode at dynamicduel.com war and note that our lowest tier on patreon is only two dollars a month also on dynamicduel.com is a link to our merch store where we sell t-shirts hoodies stickers and more with our dynamic duel no prize artwork this week i think i might be drawing superman so check out our store if you’re a fan it’ll probably get taken down right away as have my recent batman and wonder woman t-shirt illustrations that’s crap so uh get on it while you can our next episode kind of ties into this one because we did see a brief appearance by kilowog with the help from our executive producers we put him up against a great marvel equivalent i think in that he’s also a cosmic alien badass with a weird face with a weird face we’re going kilowog versus beta ray bill a fight with a face that only a mother could love and me this fight is going to be dope it’s going to be great yeah can’t wait we want to remind everyone again to please subscribe to our show if you haven’t or please leave a rating or review on your platform of choice sharing this show on social media or in person is also a big help for us but that does it for this episode we want to give a big thanks to our executive producers ken johnson jace krump john straurowski john spees zachary hepburn and john betcha nina for helping make this podcast possible and we’ll talk to you guys next week up up and away true believers